THE CONTRACTS THREAD [with updates]

[rpfc 28,407]

What exactly was said here?

You can listen to it on the club website - that is how much the club likes Don McLardy's in-your-face 'what does that mean? Come down and have a look' stance.

Healy said that we have a number of good kids OOC and that we are struggling to re-sign them. McLardy said we were working through those negotiations but he agreed that the health of the club will be somewhat reflected by these kids signing up or not.

I think these names would make up the 'kids' that Healy was referring to: McKenzie, Blease, Strauss, Garland, Cook, Jurrah, McDonald, Howe, and Davis.

Edited June 1, 2012 by rpfc

[dee-luded 2,959]

If he was a winner that might be an argument, but he doesn't have a medal.

Thats right & IMO m0ntagna was ordinary in the G/F's.. his stats may or may not have been OK, but to me he's too ineffectual.

He seems to get a bit of the ball but doesn't seem to Hurt the opposition, especially outside. Slowish run & poor long kicks IMO.. Not rugged enough in/under but on the fringe of the pack gets it.

outside is so so... Bland.

Green would be a better outside mid.

[1858 285]

You can listen to it on the club website - that is how much the club likes Don McLardy's in-your-face 'what does that mean? Come down and have a look' stance.

Healy said that we have a number of good kids OOC and that we are struggling to re-sign them. McLardy said we were working through those negotiations but he agreed that the health of the club will be somewhat reflected by these kids signing up or not.

I think these names would make up the 'kids' that Healy was referring to: McKenzie, Blease, Strauss, Garland, Cook, Jurrah, McDonald, Howe, and Davis.

Thanks, just had a listen.

A fair question by Healy I think given the number of other clubs signing up their kids. McLardy handled himself well though I thought.

[old dee 23,788]

Jeez, OD. You are a massive killjoy.

Maybe he wants to help turn the club around? Maybe that is why he is playing with a verve and flair and went for that amazing goal on the weekend.

I refuse to see every little thing that is going right as another potential thing that could go wrong.

Not sure putting an opinion makes me a massive kill joy.

If that is your opinion so be it.

You said " it is a valid concern' I was just commenting.

The MFC has IMO a problem retaining a number of our younger players

Serves little purpose denying the problem

It must be very hard playing for the Dees at present, getting beaten by 10 goals each week is not an easy path.

If you are out of contract and your manager is saying "I think I can get you a contract at the Tigers, North or Carlton"

What would you do?

[hardtack 10,537]

The MFC has IMO a problem retaining a number of our younger players

Serves little purpose denying the problem

It must be very hard playing for the Dees at present, getting beaten by 10 goals each week is not an easy path.

If you are out of contract and your manager is saying "I think I can get you a contract at the Tigers, North or Carlton"

What would you do?

This is why we need to make a massive play for the likes of Cloke and Boak (should this couplet be shortened to Bloke?); to give the kids a sense of excitement about where this club is heading and some sort of future success to look forward to.

Edited June 1, 2012 by hardtack

[old dee 23,788]

This is why we need to make a massive play for the likes of Cloke and Boak (should this couplet be shortened to Bloke?); to give the kids a sense of excitement about where this club is heading and some sort of future success to look forward to.

For what it is worth ( not much I suspect ) you have my vote.

[rpfc 28,407]

Not sure putting an opinion makes me a massive kill joy.

If that is your opinion so be it.

You said " it is a valid concern' I was just commenting.

The MFC has IMO a problem retaining a number of our younger players

Serves little purpose denying the problem

It must be very hard playing for the Dees at present, getting beaten by 10 goals each week is not an easy path.

If you are out of contract and your manager is saying "I think I can get you a contract at the Tigers, North or Carlton"

What would you do?

C'mon, OD, all I said was that I am enjoying his footy as he has been one of the bright lights in this terrible year.

You said why would he want to stay...

Buzz Killington.

(Google it)

And I wasn't saying you don't get to say things like that, I am just pointing out that you have been a buzzkill of late.

Not that there is anything wrong with that.

[old dee 23,788]

C'mon, OD, all I said was that I am enjoying his footy as he has been one of the bright lights in this terrible year.

You said why would he want to stay...

Buzz Killington.

(Google it)

And I wasn't saying you don't get to say things like that, I am just pointing out that you have been a buzzkill of late.

Not that there is anything wrong with that.

I will try harder rpfc.

It is very difficult to see anything but problems at present.

The positives are few and far between.

[rpfc 28,407]

I will try harder rpfc.

It is very difficult to see anything but problems at present.

The positives are few and far between.

I know they are.

So let us keep them!

[Dockett 32 1,239]

Not sure putting an opinion makes me a massive kill joy.

If that is your opinion so be it.

You said " it is a valid concern' I was just commenting.

The MFC has IMO a problem retaining a number of our younger players

Serves little purpose denying the problem

It must be very hard playing for the Dees at present, getting beaten by 10 goals each week is not an easy path.

If you are out of contract and your manager is saying "I think I can get you a contract at the Tigers, North or Carlton"

What would you do?

So far we have lost only someone who seemed both economical with the truth and without desire to play for our club to GWS OD. So what have we really lost? Heally of all people, raised the issue of quiteness on resignings and I thought McLardy responded well. ( Must have been hard for him not to burst out laughing). I wouldn't be jumping at shadows just yet. Harrington/Viney and co have a big task in managing all the parts to this years picture and we may have to give to get. In a negotiation you never get it all your own way. But with two first round compo picks, a likely lowly finish, salary cap room available, plus some trade value in some of our players including some of the younger ones , I would be surprised if we cant significantly improve our list one way or the other. Our position isn't unreasonable and I hope we remain calm and astute in walking through the process..

[old dee 23,788]

So far we have lost only someone who seemed both economical with the truth and without desire to play for our club to GWS OD. So what have we really lost? Heally of all people, raised the issue of quiteness on resignings and I thought McLardy responded well. ( Must have been hard for him not to burst out laughing). I wouldn't be jumping at shadows just yet. Harrington/Viney and co have a big task in managing all the parts to this years picture and we may have to give to get. In a negotiation you never get it all your own way. But with two first round compo picks, a likely lowly finish, salary cap room available, plus some trade value in some of our players including some of the younger ones , I would be surprised if we cant significantly improve our list one way or the other. Our position isn't unreasonable and I hope we remain calm and astute in walking through the process..

Me too Docket 32

[Good Times Grimes 2,396]

I was refering to Dee-luded 's order of preference as he set out below

The comment was based on Jurrah being 21 in a list of 25

in order of preference..

* Jones, Howe, TMcDonald, Davis, Garland, Blease, Fitzpatrick, McKenzie, Strauss, Rivers, Spencer, Petterd, Cook, Nicholson, Bartram, Jetta, Bennell, Jamar, Bail, Moloney, Jurrah, Bate, MacDonald, Dunn, Green.

Does that make sense?

Just winding you up, OD.

[old dee 23,788]

Just winding you up, OD.

Fell right in

Totally missed it

One to you GTG

[Nasher 33,615]

I may well be wrong, but it seems that in the last few years we didn't have this many players coming out of contract at season's end.

If we'd done a list the same time last year, i.e. before anyone had signed, it'd have looked like this:

Frawley, Watts, Sylvia, Gysberts, Morton, Grimes, Gawn, Martin, J Macdonald, Maric, Scully, Warnock, Wonaeamirri, Campbell ®, Evans ®, Johnston ®, McNamara ®, Newton ®, Nicholson ®.

It's not equally as many, but it's a lot - as I said it's normal to expect up to half, possibly more if your list is particularly unbalanced. That's why occasionally players are offered three to balance it out. I expect this is why Trengove initially was given three when Scully indicated he wanted two - notwithstanding the GWS thing I expect the club didn't want both Scully and Trengove coming OOC at the same time every year as they'd probably be continually competing for salary cap money. Not ending up with too many - or too few (which presents its own set of problems) - players coming out of contract at years end is all part of Tim H's job.

It could also be a reason why someone like Joel Macdonald gets retained on a 1 year contract as he was - it gives you some easy delisting fodder for the next year if you find yourself stacked with heaps of talent you want to hold on to. If we'd given him the flick and drafted another kid instead we'd have another kid on a 2 year contract and we'd have to find someone else to delist, possibly someone we don't want to like a Fitzpatrick.

[Good Times Grimes 2,396]

If we'd done a list the same time last year, i.e. before anyone had signed, it'd have looked like this:

Frawley, Watts, Sylvia, Gysberts, Morton, Grimes, Gawn, Martin, J Macdonald, Maric, Scully, Warnock, Wonaeamirri, Campbell ®, Evans ®, Johnston ®, McNamara ®, Newton ®, Nicholson ®.

It's not equally as many, but it's a lot - as I said it's normal to expect up to half, possibly more if your list is particularly unbalanced. That's why occasionally players are offered three to balance it out. I expect this is why Trengove initially was given three when Scully indicated he wanted two - notwithstanding the GWS thing I expect the club didn't want both Scully and Trengove coming OOC at the same time every year as they'd probably be continually competing for salary cap money. Not ending up with too many - or too few (which presents its own set of problems) - players coming out of contract at years end is all part of Tim H's job.

It could also be a reason why someone like Joel Macdonald gets retained on a 1 year contract as he was - it gives you some easy delisting fodder for the next year if you find yourself stacked with heaps of talent you want to hold on to. If we'd given him the flick and drafted another kid instead we'd have another kid on a 2 year contract and we'd have to find someone else to delist, possibly someone we don't want to like a Fitzpatrick.

Interesting. We signed some of those towards the end of 2010 though, didn't we? (Frawley, Watts)

Also, what's the rule with regards to delisting? How many do we need to make? I heard the rule was 3 changes, but does that include trades/retirements?

[Macca 16,965]

If we'd done a list the same time last year, i.e. before anyone had signed, it'd have looked like this:

Frawley, Watts, Sylvia, Gysberts, Morton, Grimes, Gawn, Martin, J Macdonald, Maric, Scully, Warnock, Wonaeamirri, Campbell ®, Evans ®, Johnston ®, McNamara ®, Newton ®, Nicholson ®.

It's not equally as many, but it's a lot - as I said it's normal to expect up to half, possibly more if your list is particularly unbalanced. That's why occasionally players are offered three to balance it out. I expect this is why Trengove initially was given three when Scully indicated he wanted two - notwithstanding the GWS thing I expect the club didn't want both Scully and Trengove coming OOC at the same time every year as they'd probably be continually competing for salary cap money. Not ending up with too many - or too few (which presents its own set of problems) - players coming out of contract at years end is all part of Tim H's job.

It could also be a reason why someone like Joel Macdonald gets retained on a 1 year contract as he was - it gives you some easy delisting fodder for the next year if you find yourself stacked with heaps of talent you want to hold on to. If we'd given him the flick and drafted another kid instead we'd have another kid on a 2 year contract and we'd have to find someone else to delist, possibly someone we don't want to like a Fitzpatrick.

If you take out the rookies it's 13 last year vs 24 this year . Massive difference . The 24 out of contract this year doesn't include any rookies . It's a high number and one that has snuck up on a few people .

It doesn't necessarily mean there is an issue - it's just an observation . I'm actually quite happy that there are a lot coming out of contract . However there are more than a few we need to move on and stitch up asap . Free agency will open the door for other 'out of contract' players to seek a move if they wish . Player movement in general will increase IMO .

[old dee 23,788]

If you take out the rookies it's 13 last year vs 24 this year . Massive difference . The 24 out of contract this year doesn't include any rookies . It's a high number and one that has snuck up on a few people .

It doesn't necessarily mean there is an issue - it's just an observation . I'm actually quite happy that there are a lot coming out of contract . However there are more than a few we need to move on and stitch up asap . Free agency will open the door for other 'out of contract' players to seek a move if they wish . Player movement in general will increase IMO .

I would like to as sure of winning Tattslotto tomorrow night Macca

[Macca 16,965]

I would like to as sure of winning Tattslotto tomorrow night Macca

I've a feeling that 'free agency' will lead to other 'out of contract' players seeking a new home . It might become a little less unfashionable to move to another club for more money , greater opportunity , a chance to play for a finals team etc etc . Big 'go home' factor with the 2 new clubs as well .

The players association have complained for years that there hasn't been enough chances for players to move . It's one of the reasons we now have free agency . I follow US sports where free agency has been in operation for a number of years - there is a lot of player movement compared to AFL .

[Demon SeaMan 108]

They need to sign Jamar, Howe, Blease, McKenzie in that order. Jamar is an all Australian, clubman & experienced head, we don't Ned to lose another one... Far too many kids then. Not to mention he still has the engine to go with the best and can't be underestimated given a shite season to date. Watch for his second half I'm telling you he'll fire, in sanctum says he wants to stay and sees sense in where clubs heading. As for Howe ( true half forward talent much needed- therefore Bate, Dunn gone, no real surprises there) Blease wants to stay in Melbourne got too much down here, stuff friend buddy crap with Scully for him to g GWS, Mckenzie in & under tag roles very valuable ( who's Brock McLean and why was there a thread early in the week to bring him back....pleaaaaaase)

Then we work on Jurrah , if loyalty & pure sentiment & love have any place in this blog stiffened, dexterous world we Live in

I love this club and believe in this talent put forward which is why the others can leave with my blessing

[loges 6,767]

Yep, at this point, about that. Hardness & work ethick, almost nil. I'd rather keep Sylvia.

Excitement counts for zero, when the tough things aren't desired. Flash over the pan.

# edit: Do you really think I right things for people to agree with? I right things hopefully for some people to think about some more.

Try thinking about a forward who can probably average 3 goals a game when he plays regularly in a side that is struggling to kick over 6 goals a game

[Dr. Gonzo 24,214]

Can we sticky this thread and make updates to the OP as new contracts are signed, trades/delistings occur etc? I think it would act as a good resource and hopefully stop talk of delisting guys who are contracted beyond this year.

Of those out of contract this year

Re-sign;

Jones, Howe, TMcDonald, Davis, Garland, Blease, McKenzie, Strauss, Rivers, Cook, Jurrah

50/50 - possible trades/FA moves;

Jamar, Moloney, Petterd, Jetta, Bennell, Fitzpatrick, Bartram, Bail,

Trade/delist

Spencer, Nicholson, Bate, MacDonald, Dunn, Green,

[dee-luded 2,959]

Try thinking about a forward who can probably average 3 goals a game when he plays regularly in a side that is struggling to kick over 6 goals a game

Try thinking about a long term culture where hard work is the norm & head over footy the expectation.

If we want to continue to play garbage football, keep the soft players & the soft bruise free culture.

No room for passengers on a workmans train. Just make way.

[Dannyz 2,746]

Can we sticky this thread and make updates to the OP as new contracts are signed, trades/delistings occur etc? I think it would act as a good resource and hopefully stop talk of delisting guys who are contracted beyond this year.

Of those out of contract this year

Re-sign;

Jones, Howe, TMcDonald, Davis, Garland, Blease, McKenzie, Strauss, Rivers, Cook, Jurrah

50/50 - possible trades/FA moves;

Jamar, Moloney, Petterd, Jetta, Bennell, Fitzpatrick, Bartram, Bail,

Trade/delist

Spencer, Nicholson, Bate, MacDonald, Dunn, Green,

I'd have Nicholson over all of Petterd, Jetta, Bennell, Fitzpatrick and Bartram.

[Dr. Gonzo 24,214]

Yeah maybe he's got pace but not sure on skill - you could stick him in the 50/50 group.

[Good Times Grimes 2,396]

Can we sticky this thread and make updates to the OP as new contracts are signed, trades/delistings occur etc? I think it would act as a good resource and hopefully stop talk of delisting guys who are contracted beyond this year.

Of those out of contract this year

Re-sign;

Jones, Howe, TMcDonald, Davis, Garland, Blease, McKenzie, Strauss, Rivers, Cook, Jurrah

50/50 - possible trades/FA moves;

Jamar, Moloney, Petterd, Jetta, Bennell, Fitzpatrick, Bartram, Bail,

Trade/delist

Spencer, Nicholson, Bate, MacDonald, Dunn, Green,

Neeld likes Bartram a lot...I'd be very surprised to see him go anywhere. I'm also a fan of Bail. Other than that, I pretty much agree with you.