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Guest Thomo

Who can step up in the Midfield?

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Well i thought this post was a joke. I try hard not to get upset but im sorry this is bad we just lost a number 1 draft pick who we put 2 years of training into only to have him stolen and now you want to throw away another really ? We already have put 3 years in with this kid as a number 1 pick as a tall forward who all good judges no take time and he has elite skills and a great footy brain james hird like and to solve our mid problem you say trade him he is only potential im really amazed at this comment lets solve a problem by making another problem this kid will be a MFC champion and if you ever want to trade for a gun mid we have 40 other players and 2 compo picks but not our last number 1 pick please if you dont like watts or cant see he is a keeper just wait another 12-18 months and talk to me. And yes i would love pendlebury but not for the 2008 number 1 draft pick. some watts bashers will eat there words very soon.

How about a number 1 for a number 1

Watts for Gibbs? or even Murphy

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How about a number 1 for a number 1

Watts for Gibbs? or even Murphy

Look, you can discuss the merits of trade but it's a non-starter for me because we wouldn't get what we are searching for.

Teams won't give us a Murphy or a Gibbs because they are midfield stars. Watts doesn't have the value, hell we have fans looking to trade him...

So if we can't 'turn' Watts for a star, I don't see any other option than attempting to develop this bloke into one.

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How about a number 1 for a number 1

Watts for Gibbs? or even Murphy

NO because mids are easy to find in a draft with top 10 picks but KPP are rare so no im happy them two have 1 or 2 years on watts ask me like i said when his there age

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From what I hear of Taggert I am heartened, but he'll take some work. He does have power and size, but he has some other aspects that he really has to work on. But I'll wait until I actually see him play live in a few matches before I get excited.

Bartel is a really good player, but he is definitely taggable. Ablett is untaggable, but Bartel is just really good. That's how I think of Trengove. He would be a top quality Robin, but he's not Batman. He doesn't have the speed to be untaggable, but if you give him some space then he'll kill you.

Really wanted to see Taggart in the NAB games to have a good look myself, will have to see how he comes up at Casey.

Ablett is the best player in the game and there is only one of him. I can see where you are coming from with Trengove but speed is not the only thing that makes a player untaggable, the ability read the ball and to get in and get the ball out like Black or Diesel Williams (neither are know for their speed) can also make a player untaggable. Let's see how Trengove develops in this area of the game, he has the tank to run all day which is becomming a bigger asset with the changing interchange rules and he is also good in the air, something that wouldn't be said of either Black or Williams.

But ...if he just makes it to Bartels level I think I would be pretty happy with that.

Edited by rjay

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From what I hear of Taggert I am heartened, but he'll take some work. He does have power and size, but he has some other aspects that he really has to work on. But I'll wait until I actually see him play live in a few matches before I get excited.

Bartel is a really good player, but he is definitely taggable. Ablett is untaggable, but Bartel is just really good. That's how I think of Trengove. He would be a top quality Robin, but he's not Batman. He doesn't have the speed to be untaggable, but if you give him some space then he'll kill you.

I don't agree.

He has deceptive pace.

And Bartel is not taggable either - he just has had the luxury of letting others be the star while he has expertly filled roles for the cats.

When he has needed to, he has been the star and is not tagged out of games.

I see Trengove as being very similar.

Guess it depends on your definition of "taggable" though.

Do you think Lenny Hayes is taggable?

Edited by Arsene Wenger

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Bartel has won a brownlow and a norm smith. If Trengove becomes like Bartel i will be over the freaking moon, not just "pretty happy with that".

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tom mcdonald and sellar could be part of that group.

Point taken on McDonald. I left him out.

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Look, you can discuss the merits of trade but it's a non-starter for me because we wouldn't get what we are searching for.

Teams won't give us a Murphy or a Gibbs because they are midfield stars. Watts doesn't have the value, hell we have fans looking to trade him...

So if we can't 'turn' Watts for a star, I don't see any other option than attempting to develop this bloke into one.

Lets just throw in half a dozen picks from the next draft as well, should do the trick ;)

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Look, you can discuss the merits of trade but it's a non-starter for me because we wouldn't get what we are searching for.

Teams won't give us a Murphy or a Gibbs because they are midfield stars. Watts doesn't have the value, hell we have fans looking to trade him...

So if we can't 'turn' Watts for a star, I don't see any other option than attempting to develop this bloke into one.

No one seems to want to trade for a good mid to fill the obvious gap, nobody wants to wait for one to be drafted and developed into this mid we need.

I would not be holding my horses on enough of the current guys to fill this gap to be honest. I think something big needs to be traded to get something big in return.

I was suggesting the Watts/Pendlebury trade as it would be along the lines of the Kennedy/Judd trade, which has done wonders for Carlton.

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No one seems to want to trade for a good mid to fill the obvious gap, nobody wants to wait for one to be drafted and developed into this mid we need.

Ahem, I'm prepared to wait until years end to either trade for a star or draft a star for the near future to fit into our midfield.

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Ahem, I'm prepared to wait until years end to either trade for a star or draft a star for the near future to fit into our midfield.

Let me requote. Everyone is willing to trade, though nobody is willing to trade anything of value. Right now i would say our teams highest disposable currency is 'potential' if a trade were to take place. Watts is probably the most realistic one that would get it across the line and no-one on this forum seems to know where he should even play. Any position he can currently play, can be covered by someone else. (Clark, Martin, Howe, Jurrah ect)

If our team is taking a backbone approach to things now then why would they not have a backbone to get what they need and hold back from trading a player who is yet to reach there potential and does not have a position that he actually owns in the first 18.

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all can and have to step up for us to improve quite drammatically.

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Let me requote. Everyone is willing to trade, though nobody is willing to trade anything of value. Right now i would say our teams highest disposable currency is 'potential' if a trade were to take place. Watts is probably the most realistic one that would get it across the line and no-one on this forum seems to know where he should even play. Any position he can currently play, can be covered by someone else. (Clark, Martin, Howe, Jurrah ect)

If our team is taking a backbone approach to things now then why would they not have a backbone to get what they need and hold back from trading a player who is yet to reach there potential and does not have a position that he actually owns in the first 18.

I am telling you that trading Watts will not get us Pendlebury and adding assorted crap (fringe players, picks in the teens, etc) will not get us that star player.

It is not a Judd/Kennedy deal that got Judd, it was a Judd for Kennedy and Pick 3 and assorted crap (Pick 20).

So if you want to get Gibbs, Murphy, or Pendlebury you will have to give Watts and Trengove.

The price is too high.

The only way we are going to attract a 'star' player is if they are coming back to Victoria and we 'outbid' through the comp picks.

We are not attractive for out and out stars at the minute to cross from Melbourne clubs and we have no value that we want to give up.

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I would actually do a Watts for Dustin

I am telling you that trading Watts will not get us Pendlebury and adding assorted crap (fringe players, picks in the teens, etc) will not get us that star player.

It is not a Judd/Kennedy deal that got Judd, it was a Judd for Kennedy and Pick 3 and assorted crap (Pick 20).

So if you want to get Gibbs, Murphy, or Pendlebury you will have to give Watts and Trengove.

The price is too high.

The only way we are going to attract a 'star' player is if they are coming back to Victoria and we 'outbid' through the comp picks.

We are not attractive for out and out stars at the minute to cross from Melbourne clubs and we have no value that we want to give up.

I would trade Watts, Morton and assorted crap for a Dustin Martin in a heartbeat.

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Watts, Morton and assorted crap.

Right now that trade is - could be A-C grade potential player, A-F grade potential player, and assorted crap.

If I was Carlton or Collingwood looking at that trade it would be possible crap, probable crap, and assorted crap.

I am sorry, but that trade isn't going to wash.

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I would actually do a Watts for Dustin

I would trade Watts, Morton and assorted crap for a Dustin Martin in a heartbeat.

Again, not going to happen.

The tigers would see the same as Carlton or Collingwood.

Give away a A+-B+ potential goal scoring mid for possible, probable, and assorted crap.

Now I hold out hope for Watts and Morton (less so the latter) but I know the industry view (we all do) and it is not flattering of either (moreso the latter).

Edited by rpfc

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I would actually do a Watts for Dustin

I would trade Watts, Morton and assorted crap for a Dustin Martin in a heartbeat.

Not a chance

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Not a chance

Any better suggestions? besides waiting and hoping one develops into one? because there's no guarantee there

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RPFC has it right here.

If you can imagine a trade where we get a good deal then its pretty damn unlikley that the rival club would think its a good deal too.

Unfortunatley Demons supporters are about the only people in australia that rate Watts, Gysberts, Bail etc. We do so based on current output and potential/age rather than actualy output here and now. Untill these guys forfill their potential other clubs are unlikley to see the currancy that we do

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It will be interesting to see how our midfield plays this year. Our midfield has been poorly coached over the past three years, our structure and set ups have been extremely poor. To me we are 90% there we just need to add some line breakers, we look very one paced, Blease, Sylvia, Bail and Nicholson are players on our list now that can run with the footy, I would like to see the first two Blease and Sylvia with it more especially Sylvia as they have the footskills to kick the ball to our forwards advantage.

It's funny how Trengove is hardly mentioned as becoming elite, to me he reminds me of Dane Swan, he is starting to get the same shoulders and as his body gets stronger he will be break tackles. His pace is the only concern but he is one player that will have a high cruising speed.

Outside quality is what we need.

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Let me requote. Everyone is willing to trade, though nobody is willing to trade anything of value. Right now i would say our teams highest disposable currency is 'potential' if a trade were to take place.

No. I believe our Compensation picks are. There's our value.

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Watts will be an elite ,elite , elite player.

Only an idiot would trade him.

This year he will start to dominate .

Quote me .

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No. I believe our Compensation picks are. There's our value.

I can't think of a more perfect example of the lure of potential than draft picks. Totally untried, raw materials to mould whatever kind of player you want.

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Any better suggestions? besides waiting and hoping one develops into one? because there's no guarantee there

There's no guarantee anywhere.

I think you are correct to say if we were to trade we would need to trade something of value. So many supporters of all clubs seem to think they can trade their unwanted players for gold, you hear that rubbish all over the radio talk back around trade time. I think in the past we have held on to players who had good trade value that I personally would have liked to move on, I know you feel that with Watts. I don't feel the same way, I think he has something to offer and is still a developing KPP with a lot of upside, he is about to turn 21 in March.

To trade a Watts for a Martin just doesn't stack up for me. If you look at the Carlton swap (Judd/Kennedy) they were getting a senior player with leadership to captain their club. That has taken them so far but it may not surprise that they really miss a key forward to take them that bit further, Kennedy. As you point our in your posts, you can't have it all. I would rather have Watts and you a mid, it's just a matter of opinion.

I believe we are not in as bad a position with our midfield as others but this year will tell the tale. New coach, better organised midfield group hopefully working as a unit, another year under the belt for the younger players. This season will tell the tale.

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I don't think anyone would take Watts at this present time. Maybe if he has a good year teams may consider but really, other than bulking up, he hasn't (IMO) developed in any position at all. He's floated around so much that he hasn't been able to pin down a spot and call it his own. He's not a 'natural' enough player to be a dominating utility player. I hope he's kept in 1 position this year so he can stop being okay at several positions and start being dominant in 1.

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