Training - Monday 19th December, 2011

[Whispering_Jack 27,934]

They're still at it.

Today's session is scheduled to start at 9.45am at Goschs' Paddock.

After that, a session on Wednesday and it's goodbye to 20111.

[rpfc 27,406]

They're still at it.

Today's session is scheduled to start at 9.45am at Goschs' Paddock.

After that, a session on Wednesday and it's goodbye to 20111.

That's 'star date' 20111.

Captain's Log: We have been training now for weeks with...

...no end in sight...

...a yearly celebration observed by a strange native sect is...

...nearly upon us...

...more reports after that.

[Outside fifty 967]

20111. The Pre season to end all preseasons. With this punishing schedule I'm guessing our premiership window is now looking like 20113 -20116. The veterans list is a worry though.

[drdrake 3,035]

Dropped past today, a good session main focus was the running with some clearance set up work. The running was hard, all timed running, it was run as far as you can for a set time didn't have a watch but it was 3 or 4 mins, followed by short rest then do it again 6 times, the top runners did just over 2 laps appox 1km with poorer runners hitting about 800m. The stoppage work hard to gauge as it was more about set ups.

The good our boys look fitter and bigger accross the chest and shoulders

The Bad once the running had finished only 23 players were in the main group

The Ugly don't expect to see Jordie McKenzie for the first few weeks of the season

The almost good Sylvia, Grimes, Jetta, Lawrence, Tynon, Taggart, Jamar aren't to far away from joining the main group with Strauss Tapscott running laps and wouldn't be far away.

I hope most players missing today or only completing half the session is more management issues that injury. Fingers crossed we can get 35-40 players in the main group when they come back start of Jan.

[Striker475 696]

Not Jordie! Please clarify Drake?!

[Pennant St Dee 11,248]

Dropped past today, a good session main focus was the running with some clearance set up work. The running was hard, all timed running, it was run as far as you can for a set time didn't have a watch but it was 3 or 4 mins, followed by short rest then do it again 6 times, the top runners did just over 2 laps appox 1km with poorer runners hitting about 800m. The stoppage work hard to gauge as it was more about set ups.

The good our boys look fitter and bigger accross the chest and shoulders

The Bad once the running had finished only 23 players were in the main group

The Ugly don't expect to see Jordie McKenzie for the first few weeks of the season

The almost good Sylvia, Grimes, Jetta, Lawrence, Tynon, Taggart, Jamar aren't to far away from joining the main group with Strauss Tapscott running laps and wouldn't be far away.

I hope most players missing today or only completing half the session is more management issues that injury. Fingers crossed we can get 35-40 players in the main group when they come back start of Jan.

Injury, Please elaborate!

[drdrake 3,035]

Injury, Please elaborate!

Don't know what his injury is but is the only player that is stil not running Gawn had been same with Jurrah. If you haven't been running by now you are a mile behind I have been to a bit of training and Jordie is the only player I haven't seen do any running, even today Tapscott, Spencer, Cook did a fair bit of lap work.

[Guest Deefence]

A lot of boys are having surgery before the few weeks break so they are right for first week back. Jordie is one of them. Jurrah another example.

[Melbournepotter 264]

I have started my holidays, so while the kids are still at school, I also ventured down to watch a while (while I have the chance!).

Parking is hard to get but you can find spaces just back over the river and walk 12 mins or so to the paddock.

My general observations were;

 

• Leigh Williams is one big unit, although in drills later, Frawley seemd to be able to push him around. However, he looks good in general movement.

 

• Trengove was generally leading his group in the lap runs.

 

• Blease hasn't developed the stamina yet to push in the lap trials. He was puffing hard and red in the face .

 

• Davis and McDonald seem to have got bigger  especially across the shoulders.

 

• Bate has slimmed down in the thigh area and was moving a bit more freely than at times last year.

 

• Davey looked proppy when doing the lap trials. He was almost half limping, but looked ok in the drills later. Perhaps it's just his running style. I'm not usually this close when at the games.

•  Jetta and Howe were doing forwards drills on their own with trainers while the other guys were running lap trials. Grimes was with them as well.

 

• Tapscott was doing laps and he seems to have grow a bit taller with even more muscle. He is seriously solid.

 

• Sellar looked ok in the running and drills. Looks like a bigger, more agile Brad Miller.

 

• Viney Jnr was doing a few laps later and he will also be a very solid unit. He's already bigger than a few of the melbourne players.

 

• Couch looked ok. He's certainly of a good size and held his own during the trials. He looked good in the drills. 

 

• Cook was doing laps ... continually on his own. He doesn't seem to have changed shape at all.

 

• James Strauss was running freely, although at abn even pace while I was watching. I couldn't see any hint of a hindrance from the broken leg.

 

• Jake Spencer was running laps ok.

[Tim 2,788]

I was there for a little while.

Some observations, and conclusions therefrom: Tom McDonald impressive in the running, also looks stronger; Bate back a bit, which suggests some of the others may have improved their fitness, given that he was apparently leading the way early on. Cale looked to be working hard in the running, but had more in front of him than I would have thought, given his "big engine" reputation - perhaps looks a little stronger in the legs. To my eye, Gys also looks stronger in the legs. I was impressed with the pace at which Strauss was reeling off his laps - he was going at a solid pace for what seemed at least half an hour. Troy Davis looked good as a key back type in the clearance drills winning some one on ones; JRiv backing into packs as usual.

It's my second look at training this season, and the intensity of effort is light years from what I had seen in previous years. Hopefully a virtuous circle, with intensity building on itself.

[DeeSpencer 23,079]

They were 3 minute repeats. Nicholson blitzed the first one spacing the rest of the runners before being hindered in the second and not participating in training after that.

Gawn(obviously) and Clark, Evans and Magner were unsighted to me. Martin and Bail did the running only.

Rehab group as above. Grimes and Jetta looked ready to step straight back in, they did a lot of their own stuff and 400's. Sylvia, Jamar, Lawrence, Taggard, Tynan were all in rehab but looked pretty fit. Spencer, Tapscott, Cook and Strauss were those who just did laps. As mentioned McKenzie didn't do much at all. Jurrah popped out for some sunshine before going back in.

To be honest I thought the drills were a bit average today, but it's my first session of the season. I actually preferred Collingwood's training that involved ball work at the start followed by small group skill sessions. To me it looked more efficient in building skills, but I understand that our initial focus is fitness and game plan more than individual technical aspects.

Lastly Aaron Davey and Sam Blease are bordering on disgraceful. Time and time again in the repeat runs they got beaten by big Leigh Williams. Williams is obviously in reasonable nick but doesn't look fully trimmed up, he has a similar body shape to Frawley but without being as cut. So he definitely was working hard in the running so I don't understand how Blease and Davey were left in his (and every other players) wake.

[Dee-licious 1,800]

Lastly Aaron Davey and Sam Blease are bordering on disgraceful. Time and time again in the repeat runs they got beaten by big Leigh Williams. Williams is obviously in reasonable nick but doesn't look fully trimmed up, he has a similar body shape to Frawley but without being as cut. So he definitely was working hard in the running so I don't understand how Blease and Davey were left in his (and every other players) wake.

Really interesting considering the pace on these two. Blease's running was really a highlight this year like Davey has been in the past. Is it because they are doing continuous running instead of short bursts (ala in a game) that they are so far behind or is it they don't have the fitness at the moment to be at their best?

Thanks

[dee-luded 2,958]

20111. The Pre season to end all preseasons. With this punishing schedule I'm guessing our premiership window is now looking like 20113 -20116. The veterans list is a worry though.

20111. Hmmmn, I might have to dust off the Jalopy and travel over if time,,, permits???

Powers to me people >

I'll try to make it on Time, LoL...

[Tim 2,788]

Lastly Aaron Davey and Sam Blease are bordering on disgraceful.

Yeah - I couldn't figure the AD bit. He was way off the pace in the time trials, as bad as he was in games last year with his speed (compared to his early days). I recall him having injury issues, but would have expected him to be either in the rehab group doing laps, or doing a lot better compared to some big-framed guys there today.

[dee-luded 2,958]

Really interesting considering the pace on these two. Blease's running was really a highlight this year like Davey has been in the past. Is it because they are doing continuous running instead of short bursts (ala in a game) that they are so far behind or is it they don't have the fitness at the moment to be at their best?

Thanks

Talented young people sometimes tend to rest on their Laurels, as these have made life easy for them, coming through the junior ranks, only to receive a rude awakening.

Time has come to 'work' Harder to achieve their Uttermost.

[drdrake 3,035]

Really interesting considering the pace on these two. Blease's running was really a highlight this year like Davey has been in the past. Is it because they are doing continuous running instead of short bursts (ala in a game) that they are so far behind or is it they don't have the fitness at the moment to be at their best?

Thanks

Yes and the fact that both are coming of a low base. Both have had injury's to get over and both are speed athletes not endurance. It is hard to compare players they are all different and have different running capacities. The only way any of us will know if they are getting fitter is to get the data from the club. As long as both Blease and Davey and in fact all our players improve from week to week which I think they are the coaching staff will be happy.

[dee-luded 2,958]

Yeah - I couldn't figure the AD bit. He was way off the pace in the time trials, as bad as he was in games last year with his speed (compared to his early days). I recall him having injury issues, but would have expected him to be either in the rehab group doing laps, or doing a lot better compared to some big-framed guys there today.

Heres another - "Cale looked to be working hard in the running, but had more in front of him than I would have thought, given his "big engine" reputation"

[Buzzy 919]

I'd have to agree that Davey and Blease's running efforts were very disappointing - Blease's form just looks terrible and they were both wheezing their way through it. I've been surprised that Gysberts still hasn't managed to move up a group, (still in the Frawley, Garland running group) - with his body shape he should be a super long distance runner you'd think...we need him firing. A few weeks ago I heard Neil Craig really giving it to him. He also had it in for Fitzpatrick last time I was down, because Gawn kept beating him in the running...He's one that needs to lift, so I hope he gets a few rockets. Couldn't see him out there today though?

Cook still looks stick thin.. quite an awkward looking runner. Still a season away from seniors I reckon.

Rivers looks like he's really packed on some muscle this year... noticeably bigger arms and thighs, running really freely too - he kept gave a bit extra in the last 20 seconds of each run while others were dropping off. I have a feeling he's going to have a new lease of life this year.

Down at the Yarra end, Sylvia, Jamar, Viney and a lot of the new blokes were running 30ish metre sprints at 3 qtr pace, with quite a gap in between... it sounded like they were trying to get exactly the same time each run - the trainer kept yelling out '4.3, spot on' or '4.1, too fast'... Not sure what this was achieving or why they were doing this?

Josh Tynan was in this group, he looks a really good size, has some decent muscle already for a young fella and reminded me a bit of a younger Goddard... he runs very smoothly.

The skills weren't perfect in the drills after the running, but the guys were all absolutely spent. Good sesh. Can't wait for footy to be back, I can't get in to this mickey mouse Twenty 20 rubbish at the moment.

[Roger Mellie 3,485]

Yes and the fact that both are coming of a low base. Both have had injury's to get over and both are speed athletes not endurance. It is hard to compare players they are all different and have different running capacities. The only way any of us will know if they are getting fitter is to get the data from the club. As long as both Blease and Davey and in fact all our players improve from week to week which I think they are the coaching staff will be happy.

Agree - athletes are generally endurance (Jones, McLean, Moloney) or speed demons (Blease and Davey). Some times you get the odd gem who excels at both (Bail & Nicholson). It's much the same as howling down Jones and Moloney when they get smashed in a 50m sprint.

I couldn't care less if they're in the last group so long as they're improving their endurance - if Blease isn't doing PB time trials - I'll go he for chasey

(Davey has only just joined full training so would expect him to lag for a few weeks - he's way behind)

[DeeSpencer 23,079]

Agree - athletes are generally endurance (Jones, McLean, Moloney) or speed demons (Blease and Davey). Some times you get the odd gem who excels at both (Bail & Nicholson). It's much the same as howling down Jones and Moloney when they get smashed in a 50m sprint.

I couldn't care less if they're in the last group so long as they're improving their endurance - if Blease isn't doing PB time trials - I'll go he for chasey

(Davey has only just joined full training so would expect him to lag for a few weeks - he's way behind)

I'll cut Blease a bit of slack for this year, it's his first preseason after all. However, Leigh Williams in 193cm about 100kg and has only recently got off the couch. I'm not sure what Davey has been doing since he last played a game but he's has years in the system to build up residual fitness in case of injury. He's also played many games in the midfield. I don't understand how he is last of the whole group, even behind Blease after the last of the repeat 3 minute runs. Maybe big men do run as well as little men, but when an EFL full forward is out running a AFL midfielder I'd say the gap there is mental not physical.

[Keepin up with the Joneses 48]

I'll cut Blease a bit of slack for this year, it's his first preseason after all. However, Leigh Williams in 193cm about 100kg and has only recently got off the couch. I'm not sure what Davey has been doing since he last played a game but he's has years in the system to build up residual fitness in case of injury. He's also played many games in the midfield. I don't understand how he is last of the whole group, even behind Blease after the last of the repeat 3 minute runs. Maybe big men do run as well as little men, but when an EFL full forward is out running a AFL midfielder I'd say the gap there is mental not physical.

Maybe our 'high potential' midfield which excelled running forward of the ball didn't run defensively because... they couldn't? cant wait for the fun to start! As i said to a friend yesterday, at least if we're [censored] this year, we'll be fit and [censored]!

For the record, i think we'll finish 7th

[Nasher 33,047]

I'll cut Blease a bit of slack for this year, it's his first preseason after all. However, Leigh Williams in 193cm about 100kg and has only recently got off the couch. I'm not sure what Davey has been doing since he last played a game but he's has years in the system to build up residual fitness in case of injury. He's also played many games in the midfield. I don't understand how he is last of the whole group, even behind Blease after the last of the repeat 3 minute runs. Maybe big men do run as well as little men, but when an EFL full forward is out running a AFL midfielder I'd say the gap there is mental not physical.

This logic of Davey having been a midfielder for several years therefore he should be a strong endurance runner doesn't wash with me. Davey and Blease would surely be the quickest two at the club over 5 metres or so; seems like a big coincidence that these two also happen to be struggling with the endurance as well.

This thread is in desperate need of someone who knows what they're talking about chiming in, because there's a lot of guesswork going on right here that is leading to some nasty conclusions.

[Jordie_tackles 354]

Maybe our 'high potential' midfield which excelled running forward of the ball didn't run defensively because... they couldn't? cant wait for the fun to start! As i said to a friend yesterday, at least if we're [censored] this year, we'll be fit and [censored]!

For the record, i think we'll finish 7th

If you can run one way you can run back.

Poor form if you cant, i dont see how running forward tires you anymore than backwards on the field!

[Sideshow Bob 2,153]

I'm not sure why we all think Aaron Davey has or even (ever) had good endurance. The bloke is lightning fast. He goes well for 1 maybe 2 sprints then blows up. Has done his entire career. Hence the reason he got to us as a rookie as a 20/21 year old (as well as being stick thin then), the spent the next 2-3 years as a permanent FP. While onball he has more sideline breaks than Dane Swan, he should have built up a better tank over the past few years but will never be elite in this area, perhaps a good reason why he can't break a tag. Ideally he should concentrate on being quick in bursts, be our elusively quick FP again and leave the midfield for those with a tank

Edited December 19, 2011 by jako13

[Axis of Bob 10,180]

I wonder how many would call Usain Bolt 'a disgrace' if he struggled to keep up with endurance athletes during repeat sprints.

Sure, he can run 100m in 9 and a half seconds but if he can't keep up with a 200 cm ruckman like Dean Cox in repeat 2 km time trials then he is 'a disgrace'. After all, Bolt is shorter and an Olympic champion.

Worst. Olympic. Champion. Ever.