The Tom Scully Saga © continues ...

[Mac7 309]

I was having a discussion with one of my Carlton mates and he made a very salient point. What's Tom Scully actually done (apart from the Bulldogs game and a few moments here and there)? Would he really want to leave a club and place undue pressure on himself with a multi-million dollar contract? I don't doubt he's set for stardom, but at the moment he hasn't proved himself at all. I've always believed Tom will stay, but when you put this fact on the table, it makes me even surer he'll stay.

Yeah maybe.

But then on the other hand seeing things like Strauss breaking his leg might make him realize that you could be potentially 1 game away from it all being over (not that I think Strauss' career is over, just making a point that the tables can turn very quickly and some might say you should cash in while your value is high).

Edited August 9, 2011 by Mac7

[waikikkamukau 62]

As far as i am concerned 2 first round draft picks are worth more to the MFC than Tom Scully's current form

Paying more than what a player is worth is economically dumb

Not to mention the disharmony it can cause in a team environment

Here here, take the two picks, splash some more money at Col, JT and JW.

Money changes everything!

Go Dees!

[Adam The God 30,239]

Naturally. That's the other side of the coin (pardon the pun) - to simply take the money and run. But I believe Tom would back himself to overcome all hurdles and reach the A grade at MFC. He hasn't proved himself yet and I see him as a very proud individual.

[Mac7 309]

Naturally. That's the other side of the coin (pardon the pun) - to simply take the money and run. But I believe Tom would back himself to overcome all hurdles and reach the A grade at MFC. He hasn't proved himself yet and I see him as a very proud individual.

I really hope your right.

I wish sportsbet was giving odds on if he will stay I recon you would be getting great value in him staying at MFC. What do you think 10-1? More? Less?

Edited August 9, 2011 by Mac7

[e25 5]

Surprised there isn't already a market on it.

Bookies with some common decency?

I've seen everything...

[The Chazz 4,077]

Here here, take the two picks, splash some more money at Col, JT and JW.

Money changes everything!

Go Dees!

Sylvia is one of my favourite players too, but I wouldn't be splashing more cash his way unless it was a performance-based deal.

JT and JW I can appreciate earning a few more $$$ in time.

[Guest The Tweed Pig]

Surprised there isn't already a market on it.

They'd have already paid out.

[Mac7 309]

They'd have already paid out.

And we know what happened last year when they paid out on Richmond....

[Guest The Tweed Pig]

And we know what happened last year when they paid out on Richmond....

Sure.

I wasn't providing a conclusion on Scully, just the bookmakers.

[beelzebub 23,364]

Dees on the attack to hold on to Scully

Im very much in two minds about al this.. Puttig aside for the moment all the shnenanagans and whats and ifs about whehter hes signed or not already but looking at teh player himslef and worth to us going forward I can see two vastly differing outlooks.

On the one hand we have our #1 draft pick. Apparently the best thing since sliced bread. Many consider that holding on to this prized recruit is the cornerstone of our progress. Without doubt hes a talent. There would be difficulty providing an argument that he isnt worth hanfging on to and that a seeming tendency to injury he might we ldevelop into something special. To be honest and this isnt a case of bashing for bashing's sake apart form a game or two I really havent seen that much to get all gooey over. Hes good and can be costly. He favours his hands far to omuch compared to disposal by foot . Granted a lot of his work is in close and the foot in thsese instances isnt an option. He is a very good link pin. I wonder though if thats just to omuch to his game. Hes likened supposedly to a Judd inthemaking but Judd has many many more strings to his bow..and always did.

I say this not todenegrate the lad just to put his skills in perpsective. His kicking needs work, lots . His decision making is pretty good. I think many anoccasion when he looks decidely silly in the outcome its as a result of no one being ablke to back up his quickness of hands....and it goes to teh wrong person or is fumbled. Not really his fault but he needs to understand it when disposing.

He is smart and does get arond the ground a bit. Some games he's quite instrumental others Im not sure what hes tryiing to do , but again that mightbe the rest of team lagging. He does tend to view the game like chess and tries to position a move or two ahead of play. He might need to constrain himself as there arent too many Fischers or Kasparovs in Red and Blue.

But how good ? which brings us to how much ??

Personally Im not happy with the haste ( by some ) to all eggs in the one basket approach to securing him. The numbers bandied around and we'll just have to take them as read currently are 5 M over 5 y to GWS. MFC offerig 3M. Could we reatain himfor somewhere in the vicinity of our offer then that would be a marvellous outcome. Despite what many might see as a stance otherwise I would keep him. But not at any price. I sense the club needs to be verry careful in where it positions Scully's value as the knockon might just bring our ability to keep the rest of a developing core together might prove untenable.

Is 3M enough ? Well hes only a second year newby really. hasnt played as many games as we would have hoped. His development is a littel compromised as a result. Ive no doubt his professionalism would address this as an objective but will his tendency to injury curtail to a degree this ideal?

Theres an idiom "Rush to Judgement" that warns of haste in making decisions. it often happens as an outcome is desirable ahead of prudence. I would hope the MFC keep this in mind. Thats all

[jumbo returns 6,741]

Sorta related.....3AW rumour this morning from some kid who won himself a Pancake Parlour voucher - GWS are talking to Sandilands...

What's their cap? How can they afford all these 'potential' signings???

[Harcourt 146]

I certainly think this was a lie from Garry.

A "footy white lie", if you will.

Not sure of exact quotes, but I'm certain I've heard Garry say that one of the 1st things he'd do is go down to the club and sit down with Tom to find out his intentions.

Garry has been at the club a week.

The reason he lied, imo, is that it is important that the content of these discussions remains private.

Breach Tom's confidence and it will do the club no good whatsoever in these negotiations, if a decision is still to be made.

My guess is the result was the same as what has been publicly said - Scully will wait til season's end to make a firm decision.

If Garry had have acknowledged that talks have been held, even if he said there was no conclusion to be made, the wild speculation would begin.

"Did you see Garry? He shifted from left to right in his chair! He shuffled his papers! Clearly he's nervous because Scully is going!"... ad nauseum.

I think the fact it has not yet been announced that Scully has decided and is leaving, is an indication that he hasn't as yet and isn't.

I find it hard to believe Scully would be able to effectively lie to Garry's face when challenged, and I find it hard to believe that if Garry had concluded Tom is lying and leaving, that he would still be playing. Instead Garry would give him the Phil Davis, on-your-bike treatment.

Anyway, all of this is supposition, but that's how I read it...

Hang on just a minute....so you're calling an absolute champion of this club a liar are you? I thought that wasn't allowed on this site? Please remove your post immediately!!!!

Has Scully also told a "white lie"? Please clarify the difference between "lies" and "white lies". Did GWS tell a "white lie" when they said they had no agreement or contract with Phil Davis? All these catergories of lies have me confused now.

Are we allowed to just label people liars now or not because I would like to post something if we are.

[Disco Demons 92]

Dees on the attack to hold on to Scully

Im very much in two minds about al this.. Puttig aside for the moment all the shnenanagans and whats and ifs about whehter hes signed or not already but looking at teh player himslef and worth to us going forward I can see two vastly differing outlooks.

On the one hand we have our #1 draft pick. Apparently the best thing since sliced bread. Many consider that holding on to this prized recruit is the cornerstone of our progress. Without doubt hes a talent. There would be difficulty providing an argument that he isnt worth hanfging on to and that a seeming tendency to injury he might we ldevelop into something special. To be honest and this isnt a case of bashing for bashing's sake apart form a game or two I really havent seen that much to get all gooey over. Hes good and can be costly. He favours his hands far to omuch compared to disposal by foot . Granted a lot of his work is in close and the foot in thsese instances isnt an option. He is a very good link pin. I wonder though if thats just to omuch to his game. Hes likened supposedly to a Judd inthemaking but Judd has many many more strings to his bow..and always did.

I say this not todenegrate the lad just to put his skills in perpsective. His kicking needs work, lots . His decision making is pretty good. I think many anoccasion when he looks decidely silly in the outcome its as a result of no one being ablke to back up his quickness of hands....and it goes to teh wrong person or is fumbled. Not really his fault but he needs to understand it when disposing.

He is smart and does get arond the ground a bit. Some games he's quite instrumental others Im not sure what hes tryiing to do , but again that mightbe the rest of team lagging. He does tend to view the game like chess and tries to position a move or two ahead of play. He might need to constrain himself as there arent too many Fischers or Kasparovs in Red and Blue.

But how good ? which brings us to how much ??

Personally Im not happy with the haste ( by some ) to all eggs in the one basket approach to securing him. The numbers bandied around and we'll just have to take them as read currently are 5 M over 5 y to GWS. MFC offerig 3M. Could we reatain himfor somewhere in the vicinity of our offer then that would be a marvellous outcome. Despite what many might see as a stance otherwise I would keep him. But not at any price. I sense the club needs to be verry careful in where it positions Scully's value as the knockon might just bring our ability to keep the rest of a developing core together might prove untenable.

Is 3M enough ? Well hes only a second year newby really. hasnt played as many games as we would have hoped. His development is a littel compromised as a result. Ive no doubt his professionalism would address this as an objective but will his tendency to injury curtail to a degree this ideal?

Theres an idiom "Rush to Judgement" that warns of haste in making decisions. it often happens as an outcome is desirable ahead of prudence. I would hope the MFC keep this in mind. Thats all

I agree with the logic you have raised. but....compensation for scully looks like two first round picks. two years ago melbourne would have jumped but now we have a list full of potential. Essentially swapping scully (2nd year player) for potentially 2 first year players at this stage of our development puts further pressure on our weak midfield....of course we could trade those picks for something but melbournes track record at attracting senior players isn't good...

[H_T 3,043]

Sorta related.....3AW rumour this morning from some kid who won himself a Pancake Parlour voucher - GWS are talking to Sandilands...

What's their cap? How can they afford all these 'potential' signings???

Interesting.

Sandilands could be the club mascot himself !

[Happeninghunts 7]

Sorta related.....3AW rumour this morning from some kid who won himself a Pancake Parlour voucher - GWS are talking to Sandilands...

What's their cap? How can they afford all these 'potential' signings???

Is it 9 Million?

[jumbo returns 6,741]

Is it 9 Million?

Their cap? 9 mill? That's big coin....

[The Chazz 4,077]

I highly doubt that all of this asking for more money/out-of-salary-cap-income-earners is for one man only. I'm confident that the Club wouldn't risk paying Scully so much more than Trengove and Watts, just because we wanted to keep him away from GWS. I wouldn't be surprised if these Judd-like ambassador roles for companies have more than just Scully's name on them. It's just the media will construct articles as it is a hot topic, with the hope that it will generate more public discussion from other Clubs which will again sell more papers.

Oh to be a fly on the wall at the dinner tonight.

The Melbourne Football Club will be a better team with Scully in it in years to come, to say otherwise is purely based on frustration that he hasn't indicated what he wants to do next year.

[Jarka 767]

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/tom-scullys-future-a-secret-ryan-bastinac/story-e6frf9jf-1226076710819

Just wanted to add fuel to the fire, where are those marshmellows I had lying around?

[Real Demon 232]

Sorta related.....3AW rumour this morning from some kid who won himself a Pancake Parlour voucher - GWS are talking to Sandilands...

What's their cap? How can they afford all these 'potential' signings???

Nice pick up from the kid scoring a voucher on the back of B/S!

Sandilands is locked in until 2014 with the Dockers:

http://thewall.com.au/topics/29419-sandilands-extends-contract-with-dockers

Edited August 10, 2011 by Real Demon

[mauriesy 7,287]

On the one hand we have our #1 draft pick. Apparently the best thing since sliced bread. Many consider that holding on to this prized recruit is the cornerstone of our progress. Without doubt hes a talent. There would be difficulty providing an argument that he isnt worth hanging on to and that a seeming tendency to injury he might we develop into something special. To be honest and this isnt a case of bashing for bashing's sake apart form a game or two I really havent seen that much to get all gooey over. He's good and can be costly.

When Melbourne played Carlton in the infamous 'Kreuzer Cup' game of 2007, the No. 1 draft pick of 2005, Marc Murphy, was in the Carlton team that lost to Melbourne by 31 points. He was at the end of his second season, had played his 31st game and he averaged 17.9 possessions for the season. Murphy has now played 121 games and averages nearly 30 possessions a game. He killed us last week (along with Lord Voldemort).

When you say that you haven't seen much to 'get gooey over' with Scully, we need to look at him in the time frame we might retrospectively apply to Murphy. Scully has played 27 games after two seasons and averages 22 possessions in the games he's played, a better record than Murphy so far.

If we could project forward to when he's played over100 games, based on what Murphy has developed into, any suggestion Scully is not worth keeping is very dangerous.

Edited August 10, 2011 by maurie

[Pennant St Dee 13,173]

When Melbourne played Carlton in the infamous 'Kreuzer Cup' game of 2007, the No. 1 draft pick of 2005, Marc Murphy, was in the Carlton team that lost to Melbourne by 31 points. He was at the end of his second season, had played his 31st game and he averaged 17.9 possessions for the season. Murphy has now played 121 games and averages nearly 30 possessions a game. He killed us last week (along with Lord Voldemort).

When you say that you haven't seen much to 'get gooey over' with Scully, we need to look at him in the time frame we might retrospectively apply to Murphy. Scully has played 27 games after two seasons and averages 22 possessions in the games he's played, a better record than Murphy so far.

If we could project forward to when he's played over100 games, based on what Murphy has developed into, any suggestion Scully is not worth keeping is very dangerous.

Worth thinking about when supporters crucify our list with a large number of sub 50 gamers, it's the older heads we need. Menal, Christenson & Duncan all stand out aat the Cattery as they have bigger older heads around them which unfortunatley we lack and will do for another 2 to 3 years. We have quality kids and apart frm getting games into them it is imperative we trade for some experienced bigger bodies and even some mongrel, would love a Byron Pickett type to pop up again

[Jordie_tackles 354]

Here here, take the two picks, splash some more money at Col, JT and JW.

Money changes everything!

Go Dees!

I love how people are willing to "splash" money at these guys if Tom leaves but it isnt worth paying the slightest over for TS......we have some weak supporters who are to emotionally attached to the players and this affects, how good they are as people, footballers etc

[e25 5]

Even Judd, who was great in his first season, had Cousins, Kerr and Cox around him.

Not to mention a lot of other older heads.

[biggestred 5,081]

their cap i believe is the same as ours - except they will have heaps of kids on low low contracts.. therefore they have more money to spend on older players.

[rpfc 28,407]

their cap i believe is the same as ours - except they will have heaps of kids on low low contracts.. therefore they have more money to spend on older players.

Mil extra.

But much of that is to spend on the 10 extra kids they have on their list.

And before you say 'pfft' - those kids will be on around $70k and so that is $700k...