Stefan Martin

[Axis of Bob 11,912]

If Jamar gets injured, then I would think that Spencer is the obvious choice as a first choice ruckman. Johnson only went into the ruck because Spencer was injured in the last quarter, which I think indicates the pecking order.

[Dappa Dan 2,188]

I've seen enough of PJ to know he just isn't going to make it.

no...

It'll probably mean he is our only fit ruckman.

Posts like this were a daily occurence aimed at one Mark Jamar only a couple of years go. Some of the older heads here, and you know who you are, have go it wrong again. Johnson in his first few years at the dees showed more than Jamar in the equivalent time, and we all know how that turned out.

The club has persevered with players despite calls for all the know it alls here for ruckmen to be dropped. Johnson will play again this year and won't be delisted. He'll be given every chance to succeed after his lack of pre-season.

Fans getting it wrong again. They'll never learn.

[Axis of Bob 11,912]

Dappa, Jamar is a very different player to Johnson.

Jamar was always a good ruckman who struggled around the ground with his workrate. Jamar has actually been very good since 2008, however he missed a bit of footy last year so was out of sight out of mind. His ruckwork remains his strength, it's just that people are recognising his work a lot more now.

Johnson is more of a running ruckman who struggles in the ruck. He's now pushing towards 26 years old (less than a year younger than Jamar) and playing second fiddle in the VFL to Spencer. The game is trending towards the stronger ruckmen rather than the linking ruckman due to the speed of ball movement - the ruckman is more like a spectator now in open play and his importance is in the stoppages.

Jamar needed to get his workrate up to AFL level, but he had all of the 'big man' tools. Johnson's running is fine, but I don't see how he can develop the 'big man' skills quickly enough to be an AFL ruckman.

What do you think?

[Eth 4]

He just needs to develop - from what I saw of him against Brisbane, he was a good ruckman, but seemed slow and indecisive with his ground work. He is a long-term plan, and I reckon he can be a good one.

[Swampfox 190]

Martin is being developed into a Utility player who can also help in the Ruck

Utility players help a teams ability to remain flexible through a whole season

I really hope Martin takes another step up as he could become even more valuable

I think his real value comes with his ability to play on the harder players to match up on

[titan_uranus 25,212]

Posts like this were a daily occurence aimed at one Mark Jamar only a couple of years go. Some of the older heads here, and you know who you are, have go it wrong again. Johnson in his first few years at the dees showed more than Jamar in the equivalent time, and we all know how that turned out.

The club has persevered with players despite calls for all the know it alls here for ruckmen to be dropped. Johnson will play again this year and won't be delisted. He'll be given every chance to succeed after his lack of pre-season.

Fans getting it wrong again. They'll never learn.

There's no comparison, other than they're both ruckmen.

Jamar always showed talent in the ruck, it was just his efforts around the ground and general ball-skills were crap. Obviously he's improved those, but his dominance is still drawn mainly from his ruckwork.

Don't say people are wrong because they disagree with you. I'll be proved wrong if and when PJ turns out to be a decent AFL player. FWIW I think he'll be delisted this year, as keeping him means someone else (younger and untried) will have to make way.