Jump to content

Sign in to follow this  
Snoopy

The Defence That Craig Built

Recommended Posts

As readers of Demonland know I post little and rarely if ever start threads but this will most likely go unnoticed if it's not mentioned here.

In the dark years, prior to Saturday night when we saw the first real evidence of the sunrise, many at our club were vilified for their part in our circumstance with few avoiding the wrath of posters and supporters. That vilification intensified as time went on.

Craig Cameron was one such person. I don't intend to enter into the well worn and now boring debate as to whether he was great or deplorable but what I will recognize here is the defense that he built.

On Saturday night our defense was made up of Frawley - pick 12, Garland - pick 46, Warnock - rookie, Bartram - 60 and Grimes pick 14. Warnock was a mature rookie punt from Sandringham and is 26 but the others are 22 or younger and will form the core of our defense for a good few years yet unless some early picks from the Prendergast years replace them. But I doubt the foundations of that defense, Warnock, Frawley and Garland will be replaced.

Prendergast will get much praise for the eventual rebuild of our Club, and while I'm a huge fan (looking at Bennell, McKenzie and Bail being later picks who look great,) he will have done so with the advantage of picks Cameron never had.

Our defense will be built by Craig and he will have his fingerprints all over our future success with Jamar ®, Morton (P4), Spencer®, Rivers(P26), Wonaeamirri®, Jones (12), Petterd(30),Bate(13) and Martin(PSD) all good chances to be meaningful members of the new era.

Thanks mate.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The most amazing thing about Warnock is that after his two years on the rookie list of zero output, he followed it up with another year on the senior list with zero output. It wasn't until his 4th year on the list, even as a "mature" recruit, that he began to have a real impact. It's a great example of the club persevering because they recognised attributes in a player that was invisible to the mug supporter.

It just makes the fire Garland and Frawley received around here based on their initial years on the list look even more ridiculous.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The most amazing thing about Warnock is that after his two years on the rookie list of zero output, he followed it up with another year on the senior list with zero output. It wasn't until his 4th year on the list, even as a "mature" recruit, that he began to have a real impact. It's a great example of the club persevering because they recognised attributes in a player that was invisible to the mug supporter.

It just makes the fire Garland and Frawley received around here based on their initial years on the list look even more ridiculous.

Agreed

It seems the potential of a player who has the attributes of a KPP has alot more time to develop within teams

We can use the Shane Valenti example of a player who tried really hard but had limited attributes because of his size , skillset or speed

The kid had to have something special as apposed to someone like Juice to stay on our list so to speak

Are we going to see the same with someone like Addam Maric etc

Not everyone makes the grade which shouldnt be detrimental to the player concerned as this isnt an easy game to play at this level

the development of players by the time they reach AFL Draft level is poor IMO

It amazes me how many cannot use their non preferred side to kick or handpass but WOW can they run

Back in the days when players aged around 16 were recruited by clubs they had full control on their developement

Tim Watson for example played seniors at age 15

IMO the best thing Melbourne could do is have a stand alone VFL senoirs team like Collingwood and Geelong

I agree that some supporters are far too harsh on some players trying to make the grade

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As readers of Demonland know I post little and rarely if ever start threads but this will most likely go unnoticed if it's not mentioned here.

In the dark years, prior to Saturday night when we saw the first real evidence of the sunrise, many at our club were vilified for their part in our circumstance with few avoiding the wrath of posters and supporters. That vilification intensified as time went on.

Craig Cameron was one such person. I don't intend to enter into the well worn and now boring debate as to whether he was great or deplorable but what I will recognize here is the defense that he built.

On Saturday night our defense was made up of Frawley - pick 12, Garland - pick 46, Warnock - rookie, Bartram - 60 and Grimes pick 14. Warnock was a mature rookie punt from Sandringham and is 26 but the others are 22 or younger and will form the core of our defense for a good few years yet unless some early picks from the Prendergast years replace them. But I doubt the foundations of that defense, Warnock, Frawley and Garland will be replaced.

Prendergast will get much praise for the eventual rebuild of our Club, and while I'm a huge fan (looking at Bennell, McKenzie and Bail being later picks who look great,) he will have done so with the advantage of picks Cameron never had.

Our defense will be built by Craig and he will have his fingerprints all over our future success with Jamar ®, Morton (P4), Spencer®, Rivers(P26), Wonaeamirri®, Jones (12), Petterd(30),Bate(13) and Martin(PSD) all good chances to be meaningful members of the new era.

Thanks mate.

Good post.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As readers of Demonland know I post little and rarely if ever start threads but this will most likely go unnoticed if it's not mentioned here.

In the dark years, prior to Saturday night when we saw the first real evidence of the sunrise, many at our club were vilified for their part in our circumstance with few avoiding the wrath of posters and supporters. That vilification intensified as time went on.

Craig Cameron was one such person. I don't intend to enter into the well worn and now boring debate as to whether he was great or deplorable but what I will recognize here is the defense that he built.

On Saturday night our defense was made up of Frawley - pick 12, Garland - pick 46, Warnock - rookie, Bartram - 60 and Grimes pick 14. Warnock was a mature rookie punt from Sandringham and is 26 but the others are 22 or younger and will form the core of our defense for a good few years yet unless some early picks from the Prendergast years replace them. But I doubt the foundations of that defense, Warnock, Frawley and Garland will be replaced.

Prendergast will get much praise for the eventual rebuild of our Club, and while I'm a huge fan (looking at Bennell, McKenzie and Bail being later picks who look great,) he will have done so with the advantage of picks Cameron never had.

Our defense will be built by Craig and he will have his fingerprints all over our future success with Jamar ®, Morton (P4), Spencer®, Rivers(P26), Wonaeamirri®, Jones (12), Petterd(30),Bate(13) and Martin(PSD) all good chances to be meaningful members of the new era.

Thanks mate.

Good post Craig....I mean Peanuts :lol:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Bravo Peanuts. This is something I've believed for a while now. CC was everyone's lovechild 3 years ago. The the minute he left he was the scapegoat. He's a very, very good recruiter, and it's no wonder he was headunted.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't think Warnock got a real go from Danner's it wasn't until Bailey played Warnock, Garland togther consistently that we really started to see something.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As readers of Demonland know I post little and rarely if ever start threads but this will most likely go unnoticed if it's not mentioned here.

In the dark years, prior to Saturday night when we saw the first real evidence of the sunrise, many at our club were vilified for their part in our circumstance with few avoiding the wrath of posters and supporters. That vilification intensified as time went on.

Craig Cameron was one such person. I don't intend to enter into the well worn and now boring debate as to whether he was great or deplorable but what I will recognize here is the defense that he built.

On Saturday night our defense was made up of Frawley - pick 12, Garland - pick 46, Warnock - rookie, Bartram - 60 and Grimes pick 14. Warnock was a mature rookie punt from Sandringham and is 26 but the others are 22 or younger and will form the core of our defense for a good few years yet unless some early picks from the Prendergast years replace them. But I doubt the foundations of that defense, Warnock, Frawley and Garland will be replaced.

Prendergast will get much praise for the eventual rebuild of our Club, and while I'm a huge fan (looking at Bennell, McKenzie and Bail being later picks who look great,) he will have done so with the advantage of picks Cameron never had.

Our defense will be built by Craig and he will have his fingerprints all over our future success with Jamar ®, Morton (P4), Spencer®, Rivers(P26), Wonaeamirri®, Jones (12), Petterd(30),Bate(13) and Martin(PSD) all good chances to be meaningful members of the new era.

Thanks mate.

Absolutely right 'Peanuts', CC did quite a lot of good work. He selected numerous good kids, & we will never know which players could have been A grade with a topline football dept with the necessary funds to teach them & bring their football on.

Our club has been poor developing our kids as have other struggling clubs.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't think Warnock got a real go from Danner's it wasn't until Bailey played Warnock, Garland togther consistently that we really started to see something.

I don't think Warnock deserved an opportunity under Daniher. He was largely tripe at Sandy & showed nothing, nothing to suggest he would be an AFL level player let alone a KPP. I admit I was keen to see him cut three years ago. Very happy to be proved wrong & hope he continues to prove me wrong for a good few years.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Warnock wasn't really pushing for selection early on, but there were definitely signs that he could be an AFL player with development. It's lucky that he made an impact in that last year of his contract, though, because the end was nigh!

What he had, which others didn't, was legspeed. Key defenders with legspeed are very rare and that was enough to keep him on the list. He was still a dependable defensive stopper at VFL level and, given our historic weakness for tall defenders he was given plenty of time.

Edited by Axis of Bob

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Good call.........like all recruiters, Craig Cameron has had hits and misses, but overall I think he did a great job with the MFC, and left our list in a better place than what found it. We can't ask for much more than that!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am going to cop it here, but our kids struggled to push though because Nathan 'Chopper' Carroll did his job down back for a few seasons there. It was when he started to wane that the dees toyed with anything they had (including Buckets Holland down back). This opened the door for Warnock.

Warnock was a gamble that paid off, and he has pinned it down ever since. Garland and Chip copped it big time early on in their career. I was never one to ride chip, but Garland was a guy that I could not figure out. I never bagged him, but I wasn't going to back my house on him being the player he is (or is going to be) today.

Just look at them now..........great perseverance from our list management team!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

"I don't think Warnock got a real go from Danner's it wasn't until Bailey played Warnock, Garland togther consistently that we really started to see something."

That's exactly what I reckon, "Steamin'". I remember his first 2 games. The unlucky loss to Adelaide in Carrara, then the upset win in Sydney. His stats weren't good in either match, but I thought he looked promising. He wasn't picked again very much by Danners.

Edited by JUMPING JACK CLENNETT

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am going to cop it here, but our kids struggled to push though because Nathan 'Chopper' Carroll did his job down back for a few seasons there. It was when he started to wane that the dees toyed with anything they had (including Buckets Holland down back). This opened the door for Warnock.

Why would you cop it for that? It's absolutely spot on I reckon. Hannabal's question at the time was "where's he going to play and who's he better than?" The answer is of course full back, and he's better than Nathan Carroll, but it was impossible to forecast that at the time. Carroll was playing good footy and Warnock was coasting in the VFL.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My understanding is Daniher was a big fan of Warnock and was instrumental in getting him onto our list from Sandringham.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's interesting to say that Craig Cameron is actually responsible for our emerging backline talent; it's not something I disagree with.

I think it's lesson on building a list - get the talls first because they take longer, then supplement them with hundreds of skilled mids.

Just so happens that our rebuilding has spanned 2 recruitment gurus.

Edited by Enforcer25

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My understanding is Daniher was a big fan of Warnock and was instrumental in getting him onto our list from Sandringham.

Same here. I thought Daniher gave him significant opportunity to develop of a young defender via the rookie list.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am going to cop it here, but our kids struggled to push though because Nathan 'Chopper' Carroll did his job down back for a few seasons there. It was when he started to wane that the dees toyed with anything they had (including Buckets Holland down back). This opened the door for Warnock.

Warnock was a gamble that paid off, and he has pinned it down ever since. Garland and Chip copped it big time early on in their career. I was never one to ride chip, but Garland was a guy that I could not figure out. I never bagged him, but I wasn't going to back my house on him being the player he is (or is going to be) today.

Just look at them now..........great perseverance from our list management team!

The big difference now is that we have a full-time development coach ( Kelly O'Donnell) and a professional approach to developing our young talent. We are also beginning to get on top of player conditioning and injury prevention. We are even starting to get some decent facilities.

Craig Cameron did a good job as a recruiter - and Danners did a good job as senior coach. We just fell off the pace in between them. We had some terrific individuals there - like Chris Fagan - but they had no support resources

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The big difference now is that we have a full-time development coach ( Kelly O'Donnell) and a professional approach to developing our young talent. We are also beginning to get on top of player conditioning and injury prevention. We are even starting to get some decent facilities.

Craig Cameron did a good job as a recruiter - and Danners did a good job as senior coach. We just fell off the pace in between them. We had some terrific individuals there - like Chris Fagan - but they had no support resources

Yep, Kelly & others.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Social Media

  • Match Previews, Reports & Articles

    THE TRADING CHRONICLES 2019

    PART ONE - OVERTURE  I have a disclaimer at the outset. I’m not a fan of the races - be they horses or motors of any kind. Once the final siren sounds on the football season, I find the month or so that follows and corresponds roughly with the Spring Racing Carnival to be the most boring time of the year for sports fans. You turn on the radio and you’re confronted by the monotonous drone of a self-proclaimed racing expert or by the nasally twang of an ex-jockey banging on about the equine p

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Special Features 7

    CHANGES 2019 by The Oracle

    PART 1 - IT’S A LITTLE MORE COMPLICATED THIS TIME This year’s free agency, trade and draft period will see the usual drama and upheaval as the AFL’s 18 clubs seek to better their lists in order to challenge for finals and possibly premiership honours. Long before the final siren sounded on the season just over a week ago, the maneuvering was under way with player agents and clubs discussing possible player movements and in some cases, deals had already been done.  Yesterday, the r

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Special Features

    HOW FAR SOUTH? by George on the Outer

    It was appropriate that Melbourne was playing its last game of season 2019 in Hobart.  After all, how much further south could the team go? And much as it has done in many of the previous 22 games, the side managed to extract a loss from a winning position by simply giving the ball back to the opposition time and time again. In fact, they gave it back to the opposition to the tune of 53 points from turnovers while, by way of contrast North Melbourne contributed  only 17 points to their oppo

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Reports

    COOKED by The Oracle

    I can vividly remember when the Demons ventured onto Blundstone Arena for the first time in early 2016 only to lose to the Kangaroos by 20.11.131 to 21.10.136.    Melbourne was then a team on the up and up: young, enthusiastic and bold. It gave up a huge quarter time deficit after kicking against a strong wind but made that up by half time and fell dramatically short after an exciting high scoring affair.  The team lost no fans that day - they were willing to take the game on and attac

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Previews

    HELP by KC rom Casey

    The Casey Demons finished off their home and away season against Frankston at Skybus Stadium on Sunday with a narrow, unconvincing 6-point victory that left the door slightly open for a top eight berth when the VFL finals begin in a fortnight’s time. While sunny skies prevailed over Frankston in the morning, the skies became overcast by noon and heavy waves pounded the bay nearby as the rains came in to greet the players as the game started. And conditions stayed dark and dreary for the rem

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Casey Articles

    THANKS BUT NO THANKS by George on the Outer

    Thanks, but no thanks! In a round where the club was supposed to thank their fans for the support during the year, the Melbourne Football Club chose to do otherwise with a 53 point loss to a team that sat 15th on the ladder.  Don’t give us cheap jumpers that can’t be sold in the Demon shop.  Don’t give us vouchers to shop there, give us something on the field, which is why we come to the football in the first place. It was a disgraceful performance, which started with a disgracefu

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Reports

    SLEEP OUT AT THE MCG by The Oracle

    Around about 12 months ago Melbourne and Sydney fought out an epic battle between two top eight teams fighting for the best possible ladder position in the lead up to the finals. The Swans triumphed by 9 points at the MCG after the Demons came back from five goals down at three quarter time. But for its poor kicking for goal, Melbourne might well have won the game and finished in the top four. Who knows what might then have happened for the club in September? As a consequence, the person re

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Previews

    A LITTLE RAY OF SUNSHINE by KC from Casey

    Two clubs that have been hard hit by injury recently took part in a dour battle under dark clouds and, with intermittent showers falling, it wasn’t a pretty game at Victoria Park on Sunday. Despite all that, the Casey Demons added a little ray of sunshine to their day to get the job done over a "traditional" rival with a 15 point victory over Collingwood VFL that breathed life back into their season. There were a few highlights at the ground that in past days has seen many titanic batt

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Casey Articles

    THE RETRO ROUND by George on the Outer

    We have seen it all before… Yes, a wonderful idea to showcase what used to be in football.  Big crowds, umpires who knew how to apply the rules and not opinions, high marks, skilful players. But for the Melbourne supporters their retro is what it has been like for the past 10 years. Losing games, end on end, year after year.  Opportunities squandered in front of goal. VFL standard players running around at the MCG. Just more of the same, and the game against Collingwood was no ex

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Reports

    THE PEOPLE SPEAK by The Demonland Crew

    Thanks to Demonlanders for their input into this week’s preview. Ralphius Maximus is short and bittersweet: We'll crack in at the bounce to create a contest, win our share of the ball, butcher the forward movement and get scored on easily from the intercepts. Not that hard to predict. Big Demon says: Unfortunately Collingwood will win because they have a lot more to play for. We will be good in parts but really the season is well over so we will have to put up with those bell

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Previews

    WHAT, NO BLOOD? by George on the Outer

    The feeling when turning up to the MCG on a Saturday night to play a top four side in Richmond, while the Melbourne sits cemented in close proximity to the bottom of the table is like attending the Colosseum in Ancient Roman times. The expectation is that a bloodbath is about to occur. There are 100,000 Richmond members and 50,000 Melbourne members, and despite the fact that it turned out to be a wet night after half-time, a crowd of only 37K bothered to turn up. That should never have happ

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Reports

    A MAN’S ERRAND by KC from Casey

    A young and undermanned Casey Demons were sent out on Saturday to the Swinburne Centre in the shadows of the MCG on a man’s errand against a very experienced Richmond VFL combination which is the clear ladder leader and fielded no less than 18 AFL listed players. It was expected to be a rout and the Tigers made easy work of it in the early stages when they held a 26 point lead by quarter time. To their credit however, the Demons weathered the storm and kept their opponents within the range

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Casey Articles

×
×
  • Create New...