TRAINING TODAY 8/2/10

[Curry & Beer 5,444]

Now that's hyperbole.

not so much

would have been devestating on a number of fronts

[Deestroy All 14,266]

Tapscott is fine, he was just not in Melbourne. So we're still a chance at winning this flag.

[titan_uranus 25,020]

not so much

would have been devestating on a number of fronts

No, it was hyperbole.

There would definitely have been a negative impact. But it wouldn't have set us back 5 years.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

No, it was hyperbole.

There would definitely have been a negative impact. But it wouldn't have set us back 5 years.

Agree.

About as devastating as if you said 12 months ago, Brock McLean was to leave MFC. A short term blip but the Club's future does not just revolve around Davey. He is a cog but its not like Pavlich leaving Freo, Judd leaving Carlton, Brown leaving Brisbane and Hodge/ Buddy leaving Hawthorn.

[Roost It 1,434]

Agree.

About as devastating as if you said 12 months ago, Brock McLean was to leave MFC. A short term blip but the Club's future does not just revolve around Davey. He is a cog but its not like Pavlich leaving Freo, Judd leaving Carlton, Brown leaving Brisbane and Hodge/ Buddy leaving Hawthorn.

I'd be confident in saying that Davey is profoundly more important to the psyche of our club than a lot of others we could lose, including Mclean

[DemonDan... 77]

Agree.

About as devastating as if you said 12 months ago, Brock McLean was to leave MFC. A short term blip but the Club's future does not just revolve around Davey. He is a cog but its not like Pavlich leaving Freo, Judd leaving Carlton, Brown leaving Brisbane and Hodge/ Buddy leaving Hawthorn.

what the? yeah it is!

Geez, Davey was the difference between winning/losing by a much bigger margin, in a lot of games last year. ive joked with mates that we'd have finished 17th this year without him

he is our pav, juddy.. with more and/or better support around him, im confident he'll be considered an A+ grade player, by the end of the year.. have some faith!

losing davey wouldnt put us 5 years behind, (give benefit of the doubt WYL was exaggerating in his text?)

but it probably would have put us a season or two behind in terms of 'personal' development for the indigenous lads, esp all of them coming from so far away..

theres no way in the world jurrah, jetta and benny would have had the big and immediate impact they did last year, without davey having been there. he's like a brother to them already.

('wheels' too deserves a mention in the same vein for helping davey when he began)

Edited February 9, 2010 by DemonDan...

[Curry & Beer 5,444]

what the? yeah it is!

Geez, Davey was the difference between winning/losing by a much bigger margin, in a lot of games last year. ive joked with mates that we'd have finished 17th this year without him

he is our pav, juddy.. with more and/or better support around him, im confident he'll be considered an A+ grade player, by the end of the year.. have some faith!

losing davey wouldnt put us 5 years behind, (give benefit of the doubt WYL was exaggerating in his text?)

but it probably would have put us a season or two behind in terms of 'personal' development for the indigenous lads, esp all of them coming from so far away..

theres no way in the world jurrah, jetta and benny would have had the big and immediate impact they did last year, without davey having been there. he's like a brother to them already.

('wheels' too deserves a mention in the same vein for helping davey when he began)

also Davey is a huuuge favourite amongst the supporter base, and in particular a lot of kids would have been gutted. Whn you consider the lack of senior leaders at the club the cupbaord would have been very bare. Well he got his price and stayed thankfully

[Keyser Söze 0]

...

I think you overestimate Davey, or what he has shown so far.

He's a very good player, but I am yet to see him take a game by the scruff of its neck and win it off his own boot.

He's kicks timely goals sometimes and is very clean with the footy, and may take that next step... but so far he hasn't.

[DemonDan... 77]

I think you overestimate Davey, or what he has shown so far.

He's a very good player, but I am yet to see him take a game by the scruff of its neck and win it off his own boot.

He's kicks timely goals sometimes and is very clean with the footy, and may take that next step... but so far he hasn't.

I think you underestimate Davey, who at his age should to continue to peak in his career..

IMO Graduated from 'b' to 'A' class last year and i just feel with better, growing support around him, he'll step up again..

He hasnt had the luxury that most great mids of the game have at the moment - a great midfield in general- around him.

For eg: judd has been nowhere near as dominant in his last 2 seasons, as he was before he left WCE. Why?

No Cousins, no kerr, no embley, no fletcher, even no cox to an extent.. no support..

Just kids, Gibbs, Murphy, nick stevens and camporeale were ok, but nowhere near great, or near the level of the WCE bunch he previously played with..

If Davey (and co.) can get enough midfield support from the newbies and the backline progresses, it should free Davey up to float across half-forward, ahead of the play at times,

instead of having to run down back to help support an overwhelmed backline, while expecting himself / wanting himself to be able to do the spectacular, match-winning play we all know he can produce. (bruce could be mentioned in this category too, having to play and fill 100 different roles a game, in the past)

You could see this in his frustration in Davey during the last couple years, even giving away uncharactistic frees in the process at times and i believe, last year he excelled playing a role, that the coaches had asked him to step into, that im sure he would prefered not to have had to do.

Would be and would be seen of equal class and value as a Chapman or a Dal Santo, if they swapped teams - and imo our next Captain.

[jayceebee31 761]

I think you underestimate Davey, who at his age should to continue to peak in his career..

IMO Graduated from 'b' to 'A' class last year and i just feel with better, growing support around him, he'll step up again..

He hasnt had the luxury that most great mids of the game have at the moment - a great midfield in general- around him.

For eg: judd has been nowhere near as dominant in his last 2 seasons, as he was before he left WCE. Why?

No Cousins, no kerr, no embley, no fletcher, even no cox to an extent.. no support..

Just kids, Gibbs, Murphy, nick stevens and camporeale were ok, but nowhere near great, or near the level of the WCE bunch he previously played with..

If Davey (and co.) can get enough midfield support from the newbies and the backline progresses, it should free Davey up to float across half-forward, ahead of the play at times,

instead of having to run down back to help support an overwhelmed backline, while expecting himself / wanting himself to be able to do the spectacular, match-winning play we all know he can produce. (bruce could be mentioned in this category too, having to play and fill 100 different roles a game, in the past)

You could see this in his frustration in Davey during the last couple years, even giving away uncharactistic frees in the process at times and i believe, last year he excelled playing a role, that the coaches had asked him to step into, that im sure he would prefered not to have had to do.

Would be and would be seen of equal class and value as a Chapman or a Dal Santo, if they swapped teams - and imo our next Captain.

Davey will improve further over the next two years built on fitness and confidence. Flash is just oodling with confidence at the moment.With more success, this will bring out the ultimate in him. And agree re your point with others around him.Do not know whether hewill be given the captaincy (I would like him to be) but if he doesn't will become vice- captain.

[Still Waiting 94]

Correct JCB. Not sure why many people still don't see Davey as an elite footballer.Pretty obvious other clubs do.When he gets a further-developed injection of skills around him he will destroy clubs with his sublime skills.There is no doubt he was streets ahead of most other players skillwise in 09. When team mates adjust even more to his quick passes and lightning reactions we will win more games.This guy is already borderline champion and only needs a touch more support to become one of our greats.IMO he would have left a massive hole had he left and is worth every cent he can squeeze out of the club.People who under estimated him a couple of seasons back already must be embarrassed.

[jabberwocky 2,301]

Agree.

About as devastating as if you said 12 months ago, Brock McLean was to leave MFC. A short term blip but the Club's future does not just revolve around Davey. He is a cog but its not like Pavlich leaving Freo, Judd leaving Carlton, Brown leaving Brisbane and Hodge/ Buddy leaving Hawthorn.

Davey has increased value to us because currently (well in 09 anyways) he is the only player capable of performing the role he did. Good sides have a few players capable of breaking clear with speed and executing the delivery to the right target. We have Davey.

We have the grunt at the clearances, we nee the poise, speed and skill

IMO this is our greatest area of need. If we have some other players step up and play this role well this year it will make us a decidedly better side.

[H_T 3,049]

Managed to get there and this is what I saw

No - Shows = Bruce and Tapscott

Rehab = Meesen, Johnson, Gawn, Blease

Managed Loads group = Bate, Scully, Garland, Watts

Main group = everyone else including Aussie

Only about a 1 hour session all told

No real standouts

Observations = Trengove great, Davey beautiful skills, Jurrah sublime, Sylvia looks a million bucks as did Maric.

Any questions happy to answer if I can

Thanks for the update. Blease still in the rehab group, I was hoping he would be in the managed loads group at least. Bailey did give a positive report on him at the AGM.

Rubbish.

Agree.

Is Tapscott okay? any one heard anything on him?

Tapscott is fine, he was just not in Melbourne. So we're still a chance at winning this flag.

I was hoping they would be holding him back to prevent him from causing injuries to our other players on the track. After all he reportedly has a bit of **** in him.

theres no way in the world jurrah, jetta and benny would have had the big and immediate impact they did last year, without davey having been there. he's like a brother to them already.

Perhaps they were a bit more confident on the field with Davey & Wheels around. The way Jurrah goes about his business it may just have a reverse effect and improve Davey's game. They can all feed of each other now.

By the way, love ya font !

He's a very good player, but I am yet to see him take a game by the scruff of its neck and win it off his own boot.

He's kicks timely goals sometimes and is very clean with the footy, and may take that next step... but so far he hasn't.

Not many have won a game off their own boot of the current crop.

[Keyser Söze 0]

Not many have won a game off their own boot of the current crop.

Exactly.

And it is in no way undervaluing Davey, but he is not yet in the class of a Judd, Pavlich, Brown, Hodge or Franklin.

I have seen these 5 players take over games.

Judd has done it since going to Carlton; taking clearance after clearance in a final quarter, willing his team over the line.

Davey does not yet do this.

Given time he may; even if he doesn't it is nothing to be ashamed of.

[H_T 3,049]

Exactly.

And it is in no way undervaluing Davey, but he is not yet in the class of a Judd, Pavlich, Brown, Hodge or Franklin.

I have seen these 5 players take over games.

Judd has done it since going to Carlton; taking clearance after clearance in a final quarter, willing his team over the line.

Davey does not yet do this.

Given time he may; even if he doesn't it is nothing to be ashamed of.

On the flipside, let's not forget, there is no question that he has contributed to quite a few wins in his career to date even though they may not have been entirely off his own boot. if you know what I mean. And that is what makes him so exciting to this club. No one can forget the pressure he has applied to the oppositions defenders to create turnovers that have resulted in Melbourne goals either (albeit indirectly).

[beelzebub 23,380]

Exactly.

And it is in no way undervaluing Davey, but he is not yet in the class of a Judd, Pavlich, Brown, Hodge or Franklin.

I have seen these 5 players take over games.

Judd has done it since going to Carlton; taking clearance after clearance in a final quarter, willing his team over the line.

Davey does not yet do this.

Given time he may; even if he doesn't it is nothing to be ashamed of.

I think it must also be realised that those five dint do it alone...nor could they...they had elements in their respective teams that assisted. We've lacked that caliber in times past. One man CANT do it alone.. . Now that we have some real prospects at higher end talent to merge into a real outfit then you may well see days that 'look' like this player or that takes it by the scruff of its neck and runs with it... but he'll be helped.

[Keyser Söze 0]

I do agree BB59 and HT.

I just think it's pertinent to reign in this unbridled optimism because some are losing touch with all reality, and that will only lead to angst and disappointment once the real games begin.

We'll improve and hopefully quickly, but patience is still needed and we can't let our expectations to get too far ahead of themselves.

Davey is very very good and I think he is capable of taking over a game like the 5 mentioned... but he is yet to do it.

Don't count your chickens.

Edited February 10, 2010 by Keyser Söze

[Roost It 1,434]

I do agree BB59 and HT.

I just think it's pertinent to reign in this unbridled optimism because some are losing touch with all reality, and that will only lead to angst and disappointment once the real games begin.

We'll improve and hopefully quickly, but patience is still needed and we can't let our expectations to get too far ahead of themselves.

Davey is very very good and I think he is capable of taking over a game like the 5 mentioned... but he is yet to do it.

Don't count your chickens.

The talk of Davey started as a dicussion over his worth to the team. I'd say davey is just as important off the field as on and that's why we couldn't let him go like Mclean.

[jayceebee31 761]

On the flipside, let's not forget, there is no question that he has contributed to quite a few wins in his career to date even though they may not have been entirely off his own boot. if you know what I mean. And that is what makes him so exciting to this club. No one can forget the pressure he has applied to the oppositions defenders to create turnovers that have resulted in Melbourne goals either (albeit indirectly).

HT, let's get a little serious here.Davey is not a champion at this stage, he has not one a game off his own boot,(AS THE SAYING GOES),he is a very good footballer, currently MFC best.However not in the class of possibly the best 50 in the league..Or indeed, he may just scrape in. But one would not rate him in the class of a Flower etc..(again at this stage.)

Edited February 10, 2010 by jayceebee31

[beelzebub 23,380]

Its always fraught with danger to attempt any real extrapolation of preseasons into real seasons but by all accounts Aaron is having his best yet. Possibly..emphasis, possibly with his new found position ( contractual etc ) in the club he may also rise to the associated expectations. These of himself and his peers.

he really has it within him to be quite the mercurial player. I still remember, years back , that early game against Richmond. Was as if he cast a spell on them. I just have a gut feeling we will seem him step up. He can and hopefully will put his name alongside of Flower

[H_T 3,049]

HT, let's get a little serious here.Davey is not a champion at this stage, he has not one a game off his own boot,(AS THE SAYING GOES),he is a very good footballer, currently MFC best.However not in the class of possibly the best 50 in the league..Or indeed, he may just scrape in. But one would not rate him in the class of a Flower etc..(again at this stage.)

I think we agree, if you're that serious.

I never highlighted that he was a champion, nor did I say he has won a game off his own boot JCB. All I have suggested or alluded to in response to KS, is that Davey has indeed influenced matches in other areas of his game in all fairness. Something of which should be noted.

I wouldn't speak about Davey in the same breath as a Flower, Hodge, Judd, etc to be entirely honest (or in your case - serious).

[Deeoldfart 8,035]

.....................

I just think it's pertinent to reign in this unbridled optimism because some are losing touch with all reality, and that will only lead to angst and disappointment once the real games begin.

...............

Hey Keyser, there's nothing wrong with optimism at this time of year! We are trying to build our membership base, and a large large % of prospective first time members are genuinely optimistic for the first time in the best part of a decade. Don't be such a 'party pooper'!! (tongue slightly in cheek).

[beelzebub 23,380]

Love your enthusiasm - Not going to happen

never say never !!

who of say the modern era ( Dees ) would you put next to Flower ?

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

Love your enthusiasm - Not going to happen

Agree

never say never !!

who of say the modern era ( Dees ) would you put next to Flower ?

There has been no one of Flower's quality since he retired in 1987.

A few contenders but nowhere near the all round quality that Flower possessed

[beelzebub 23,380]

curious to see how crystal balls appear with such limiting portrayals of future developments.

The reality is we cant know how high a player might climb til they are done and dusted.