TANKS FOR THE MEMORIES

[Demonland 72,230]

TANKS FOR THE MEMORIES by The Oracle

The end of a football season comes very quickly for the teams that miss the cut for the finals. In a matter of ten days time, it will be mothballs for eight clubs including Melbourne although I doubt whether, apart from those who are retiring or who will be delisted, that there will be many regrets.

One should never mourn over a bad deal. Rather, one moves on and looks forward to better days.

Over the next ten days there are two games left for Melbourne - both of the eminently losable fixtures against finals competitors in Carlton and St. Kilda. Most of us will be hoping that during this period, time moves quickly enough to allow us to negotiate these fixtures with a minimum of pain and then to get on with the rest of our lives.

The latter part of the season has been particularly hellish for the Demons because of the spectre of "tanking", a phenomenon the AFL does not recognise (which conveniently absolves it of the necessity of coming up with a solution). The circumstances of the introduction of two new clubs in 2010 and 2011 respectively and the new drafting rules to cater for their entry will temporarily remove the annual tanking discussion but it's likely to return once things have settled down.

The problem in arriving at a solution for something that does not officially exist is that there will always be someone out there prepared to break the spirit of the law if not the actual law itself.

One solution to tanking might simply be in changing the way the fixture is structured. The bottom teams from the year before could be drawn against each other early and play each other twice, thereby determining early on in the piece which teams, if any, are candidates for draft concessions in the following year.

In both 2008 and 2009 Melbourne had the tough end of the draw early but imagine if the fixture this year had provided for home games against interstate clubs West Coast, Port Adelaide, Fremantle and even Sydney in the first half of the season instead of near the end? The Demons might have had a 4/6 or 5/5 record by round ten and with far greater interest and incentive for the remainder of the season. And with the top teams from the year before all playing against each other, the AFL would still be assured of better crowds.

Unfortunately, the AFL insists instead on a programme that's tailor made for its high roller clubs like Collingwood and Carlton. That's why we see the Magpies accumulating the least amount of frequent flyer points annually and why they conveniently managed to avoid return fixtures against three of last year's top four Hawthorn, Geelong and St. Kilda altogether this year despite making it all the way to the semi finals last year. The Pies don't have to play a return match against the last of the quartet, the Western Bulldogs till round 22. Without taking anything away from their performance this year, Collingwood has benefitted from a dream programme which is probably worth 8 to 12 premiership points. That's fine if it happens to be the luck of the draw but we know that's not the case because they benefit from a skewed programme every year.

But I digress with my ranting although I will come back to the fixture later.

The rest of the season from an injury wracked Melbourne point of view is looking decidedly tough. Carlton needs to finish well in order to secure the best possible position in the lead up to their first finals appearance after eight years in the wilderness. St. Kilda has been stung by its first defeat for the season and will be determined to perform at its best in what will be its only home and away appearance at the MCG. The Demons could well succumb to a couple of beltings before their third annus horribilus in a row comes to an end.

But so what?

Last weekend we saw Essendon take a strong grip on a final eight place with a sensational victory against the previously undefeated Saints at the Docklands. At the same ground twelve months ago they lost to the same team by over 100 points in their final game for the season and the sky didn't fall in on the Bombers.

That's why I say – "tanks but no tanks for the memories and bring on 2010"!

THE GAME Carlton v Melbourne at Etihad Stadium - Saturday 22 August 2009 at 2.10pm

HEAD TO HEAD

Overall Carlton 110 wins Melbourne 90 wins 2 draws

At Etihad Stadium Carlton 2 wins Melbourne 1 win

Since 2000 Carlton 5 wins Melbourne 8 wins

The Coaches Ratten 1 win Bailey 0 wins

MEDIA

Channel 10 at 3.00pm (delayed)

RADIO ABC774 Triple M 3AW

THE BETTING (Don't even think about it!)

Carlton to win $1.08 Melbourne to win $7.00

LAST TIME THEY MET Carlton 15.11.101 defeated Melbourne 9.14.68 Round 5, 2008, at The MCG

The Demons were more than competitive at the start and took the lead at one stage in the second term before Judd and Fevola blew them away.

Brad Green was in good form with four goals but Melbourne left its charge till far too late. This was skipper David Neitz's last game for the club. He went off with an injured neck and announced his retirement not long after this game.

THE TEAMS

CARLTON

Backs Aaron Joseph Bret Thornton Jordan Russell

Half backs Dennis Armfield Paul Bower Ryan Houlihan

Centreline Heath Scotland Marc Murphy Bryce Gibbs

Half forwards Kade Simpson Andrew Walker Chris Judd

Forwards Eddie Betts Brendan Fevola Setanta O'hAilpin

Followers Matthew Kreuzer Nick Stevens Richard Hadley

Interchange Andrew Carrazzo Cameron Cloke Jeff Garlett Simon Wiggins

Emergencies Joe Anderson Sam Jacobs Chris Yarran

In Jeff Garlett

Out Mitch Robinson (foot)

MELBOURNE

Backs Matthew Whelan James Frawley Cale Morton

Half backs Kyle Cheney Jared Rivers Tom McNamara

Centreline Colin Sylvia Brent Moloney Aaron Davey

Half forwards Nathan Jones Russell Robertson Liam Jurrah

Forwards Paul Johnson Stefan Martin Brock McLean

Followers Jake Spencer Neville Jetta Matthew Bate

Interchange James McDonald Jordie McKenzie Ricky Petterd Shane Valenti

Emergencies Clint Bartram Jamie Bennell Mark Jamar

In Jordie McKenzie Jake Spencer Matthew Whelan

Out Clint Bartram Lynden Dunn Brad Miller

2009: A SPACE ODDITY

Saturday's fixture against the Blues is an odd one in that, even in these days of flaky AFL engineered programmes, the length of time elapsed since the two teams last met has been unusually long.

Their last encounter was in early 2008 when David Neitz was going around for the Demons. In fact, that round five fixture was his last game and his club has undergone a massive rebuilding programme ever since: one that is bound to continue into 2010.

Before that, the teams met in the surreal final round of 2007 when the Blues triumphantly completed the first (and probably last) "grand slam of tanking" to claim a priority draft selection by losing every game of the last half of an AFL season. The prize of course, was Matthew Kreuzer, Chris Judd, an entree into this year's finals and who knows what further glory lies in store for the Blues in the near future?

For the victors in that fateful final game from two years ago, there were few spoils. The Demons bottomed out badly in the post Daniher era, the rebuilding process has been painfully slow and the light at the end of the tunnel seems distant and dim although they are accumulating some handy young footballers for the day when they eventually break out into the sunlight.

To that end, many would say that Melbourne has followed Carlton's 2007 blueprint (pun intended) and, if that's true, then one doesn't have to be a rocket scientist to predict the outcome of this game. The Blues are two years further advanced in talent, experience and maturity and have all the incentive in the world not to lose. And you can bet the sheep station on the fact that they won't allow Melbourne's best playmaker the luxury of roaming the paddock unchecked all game this time.

Carlton by a handy margin.

[H_T 3,049]

So, Round 5 2008 was the last time these sides met. I wonder if that is a record - of games in between when they've (or sides in general) never met. Ie. 37 Home & Away Rounds in between.

Edited August 19, 2009 by High Tower

[titan_uranus 25,020]

So, Round 5 2008 was the last time these sides met. I wonder if that is a record - of games in between when they've (or sides in general) never met. Ie. 37 Home & Away Rounds in between.

I believe Richmond and Collingwood went 40 rounds up until last week's clash. Not sure though.

[Wadda We Sing 10,685]

Great read as usual and an interesting, if not obvious, solution to the tanking debate...... <_<

[Jaded No More 68,965]

In Jordie McKenzie Jake Spencer Matthew Whelan

Out Clint Bartram Lynden Dunn Brad Miller

Not sure if any of the 3 outs are injured or not.

You'd think Dunn might be, given he did a very good job on Pavlich last week.

[Carn dees 108]

Unlucky Dunn, well done whelan,

Hope fully we can get wheats right by saints clash.

[Wadda We Sing 10,685]

Unlucky Dunn....

[Einstein 1]

Emg: Bartram, Bennell, Jamar

In: WHELAN (hooray), McKenzie, Spencer

Out: Bartram, Miller, Dunn

Not sure if any of the 3 outs are injured or not. You'd think Dunn might be, given he did a very good job on Pavlich last week.

Great to see Wheels back. Good stuff.

Bartram must have just been dropped since he is an emergency. As for Miller and Dunn, I guess we'll find out. I reckon Dunn could well be injured.

[rpfc 28,526]

Out: Bartram, Miller, Dunn

These three players are going to have an interesting off-season, as I really have reservations about their futures and where the club rates their talents.

Add PJ, Bell, and Newton.

We will see what happens in October...

[Don24 103]

well as i already stated in the previous changes thread before this one was started, this must surely be the end of Bartram now.

Good changes overall. Looking forward to seeing McKenzie

[Blistering 541]

I don't know whether it looks very good for the future of the players dropped this week. Omission at this stage of the year could be a bad omen for the future.

[Redleg 40,948]

These three players are going to have an interesting off-season, as I really have reservations about their futures and where the club rates their talents.

Add PJ, Bell, and Newton.

We will see what happens in October...

If the Jamar rumour is true, or Meesen's injury is not healing, PJ is safe.

Personally I would keep him anyway as while no champion he can fill a few roles and has height, pace and mobility.

[DemonDave 1,089]

Why would it be the end of Bartram? I thought he's been playing decent football of late, and is no longer a 'danger' to us when he is about to dispose of the ball as he had been in the past. Plenty of players have been rotated through our side over the last 6 weeks, you couldnt play Whelan, McDonald and Bartram all together as we dont need 3 back pockets, so Batram gets rested to get Wheels to his 150th.

Also, the Dockers didnt see fit to drop anyone after their stirling display against us last week. Freo. Way to go.

[joeboy 3,166]

The 3 may have been dropped to make them eligible for the Scorpions' finals .

How many games do they need to have played ?

[Lil_red_fire_engine 11,201]

I am not suprised that Dunn and Bartram are out. Probably our two best taggers not playing against a team with Judd, Murphy and Gibbs. Guaranteed each of them have minimum 30 possessions each.

[Redleg 40,948]

I am not suprised that Dunn and Bartram are out. Probably our two best taggers not playing against a team with Judd, Murphy and Gibbs. Guaranteed each of them have minimum 30 possessions each.

Next you will be suggesting that we have picked a slow backline to play on a pretty quick blues forwardline.

[demon3165 2,724]

I am not surprised that Dunn and Bartram are out. Probably our two best taggers not playing against a team with Judd, Murphy and Gibbs. Guaranteed each of them have minimum 30 possessions each.

Good to see someone has turned the light on, I would not be surprised to see McKenzie on Judd an co during the game!!

[rpfc 28,526]

Next you will be suggesting that we have picked a slow backline to play on a pretty quick blues forwardline.

Or that we are trying to lose.

We are crap, they are good.

We will lose...

[DemonDave 1,089]

The 3 may have been dropped to make them eligible for the Scorpions' finals .

How many games do they need to have played ?

Joeboy I found this on the Bullants website, I think this sounds right:

Q. What are the qualifications for A.F.L. players to participate in the V.F.L. final series?

A. The full answer is long and complicated, but the basic qualification is seven games with the V.F.L. club (senior or reserves). There are a number of exceptions to this rule covering players with long-term injuries with a reduced requirement for V.F.L. participation.

The V.F.L. issues clubs with progressive lists from around round 16 as to which players are eligible or what the requirements are for the player to achieve qualification. Generally most clubs will have anywhere between 16 and 20 players eligible.

[45HG 1,539]

Great to see Wheels in - the club doing the right thing by him.

[Bring-Back-Powell 14,851]

Can understand dropping Miller and Bartram, but dropping Dunn (who's been playing really well, and needs to perform to save his career) is very harsh IMO. I would've dropped Cheney, Jetta or Martin puerly based on last weeks form.

Then again, we're trying to lose, right?

Edited August 20, 2009 by Bring-Back-Powell

[Guest Rojik of the Arctic]

I am not suprised that Dunn and Bartram are out. Probably our two best taggers not playing against a team with Judd, Murphy and Gibbs. Guaranteed each of them have minimum 30 possessions each.

It was my first thought when I saw the team. 2007 reversed. Normally I would be against it but this is bloody Carlton after all. If they can gift us the two best kids in the country then I can live with it.

[Bring-Back-Powell 14,851]

It was my first thought when I saw the team. 2007 reversed. Normally I would be against it but this is bloody Carlton after all. If they can gift us the two best kids in the country then I can live with it.

You've finally turned to the dark side mate!

I've noticed you were one of the anti tankers between rounds 15-18 and you would've sold your left leg for a win.

Edited August 20, 2009 by Bring-Back-Powell

[Adam The God 30,272]

I'm rather worried about the side we're putting out against The Filth, Mark II. Being a young side themselves, we could easily see the Blues dish up a horror performance. Yes, I know finals footy is on the line this year, but most Carlton supporters can't seriously expect them to make the top 4 this year. They may well, but won't threaten, despite one eyed media reports from Kouta.

As poor as Miller has been this year, his omission is at least a little heartening, considering he might have provided us with another target this week. One more week of frantic nail biting and then we should have a relatively relaxed weekend in Round 22...then again, Robbo will be playing his last game and St Kilda, as a rule don't play their best football at the 'G.

Edited August 20, 2009 by AdamFarr

[Bring-Back-Powell 14,851]

One more week of frantic nail biting and then we should have a relatively relaxed weekend in Round 22...then again, Robbo will be playing his last game and St Kilda, as a rule don't play their best football at the 'G.

And Robbo won't be caring about a priority draft pick!!

I won't breathe easy until 11:45pm on Saturday Aug 29th

Edited August 20, 2009 by Bring-Back-Powell