Farewell Jesse Hogan

[binman 37,726]

6 hours ago, Tram 74 said:

Nobody is going to read that, get concise.

Are you calling me nobody?

[binman 37,726]

3 hours ago, Pates said:

Only if you want it to be, it’s the world of professional sport. If he’s a proper professional he’ll come back fit and firing for 2019, I’m willing to cut him some slack but it’s not hard to see who’s going to take the mantle of whipping boy next year should he (as it appears) remain a Demon. 

What a lot of nonsense talk about there being an issue with jessie slotting back in is.

As you say this is a fully professional sport. Dr turf had said a number of times his teammates love him. They won't care a jot he was up for being traded.

They better than anyone understand that jessie was no doubt looking to maximize his financial return from his short football career to set him up for the rest of his life (over the next decade he would have earned something in the vicinity of $3 million more playing at freo I reckon - not to mention greater endorsements and future job opportunities playing in a two club city mad about their teams).

The players have see the opposite scenario as well in one of their most popular teammates in watts getting traded when he wanted to stay. Or the examples of their teammates lewis and Vince getting the brass after years of loyalty to their former clubs. Or talk of burton being traded for wingard. They know it is a brutal business, with not much room for the sort of (understandable) emotion some fans have about jessie being prepared to leave.

 And unlike fans who are upset because he wanted to leave the players will just get on with business and leave the fans to deal with their hurt feelings. 

Edited October 12, 2018 by binman

[What 18,810]

51 minutes ago, 3726062254 said:

On a side note, Hogan may want to consider how he is going to kick goals at Freo. Count the amount of demons before you hit a Freo player, a freo player who wants to head across to Brisbane in 2019.

 

https://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/ft_player_rankings?year=2018&rt=LT&st=I5

Five Demons in the top 15 is a pretty incredible stat.

Although just noticed it is totals and not averages so not quite so impressive.

Edited October 12, 2018 by Petraccattack

[Tough Kent 2,049]

I have been told too, that Jesse may start the pre-season in the defensive group. It may have been one of the reasons that returning to Perth became so appealing to him in his exit meeting.

[Tough Kent 2,049]

6 minutes ago, Petraccattack said:

Five Demons in the top 15 is a pretty incredible stat.

Although just noticed it is totals and not averages so not quite so impressive.

If we could continue to improve the quality of these inside 50s we will be hard to stop.

[DemonWA 3,425]

Im totally comfortable with every eventuality. We do a deal and it will be worth our while. We don't, and we have him in the 22 next season. After that im not overly concerned as we have depth and will get some steak knives for him when he is OOC. 

Hogan is a proud player so im not worried about him not putting in next season if he doesnt get traded

[Wells 11 4,649]

For all of those wondering how Jesse will fit back in given he flirted with Freo, imagine how it will be for Neale and Freo if they don’t trade him. Neale has  publically come out and said I don’t want to be at Freo next year! AND he’s a free agent at the end of 19. It’s way worse fr Freo and Neale than the dees and hogan.  Not out of the realms of possibility, if Bell doesn’t trade him,  that Neale consider sitting out fr the year. Hogan having an outstanding year, and Freo finishing bottom 3 with no Neale or hogan would be too delicious . 

[Lucifers Hero 36,981]

Freo do have a way of getting Hogan and importantly still save face:  trade Neale to Brisbane, then include pick 5 in a trade to us.  They can save face by saying 'we now have the picks to satisfy Melb in a trade'.

But can't see them being smart or humble enough to be that sensible!

 

Edited October 12, 2018 by Lucifer's Hero

[Gorgoroth 12,305]

9 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Freo do have a way of getting Hogan and importantly still save face:  trade Neale to Brisbane, then include pick 5 in a trade to us.  They can save face by saying 'we now have the picks to satisfy Melb in a trade'.

But can't see them being smart or humble enough to be that sensible!

 

I still don’t think that saves enough face, even if Hogan goes, they will be known as making a mess of things with multiple clubs and turds to deal with.

The Essendon guy, dodo or what ever his name is is the biggest winner here as he is no longer top [censored] in the dealing circle!

[defuture15 837]

11 hours ago, furious d said:

Time for Goody to sit down for a serious chat with Jesse. I'd be telling him that we rate him and want him to sign on long term, but our fans have been waiting 55 years and all we care about is a flag. There is no room for egos or mercaneries at MFC

Commit long term (at least 2 year extension, so 3 more years) or we'll have to start planning for the future without you. That means games into Weed and no room for you in the forward line. Jesse was All Australian CHB in juniors as a17 year old and I actually think it'd be good for him, no time to sulk as a defender. 

The evidence available seems to suggest that pick 11 wasn't going to get the May deal done, if that's the case I don't see how Collingwood can get a deal done for May either. He should be available as a FA next year and Jesse will still be tradable, though OOC just like Lever last year. We should still get a reasonable return for him. We haven't burnt May and I see no reason he wouldn't come to us next year.

Say what you like about Jesse, strange cat and all that, but he's a serious talent on a football field and he has demonstrated runs on the board as a defender.

The worst outcome for us in this scenario, IMO, is Jesse signs long term. Still a fantastic result. We would be rolling the dice with our defence next year but Lever makes it better. We'd also have to find a way to accommodate JH, SW and Tmac in the forward line next year. At a time I think we're hoping to play Gawn forward more next year as well, with Pruess spending maybe 40-50% of game time in the ruck. We'd be unbalanced going into next year but still well in flag contention.

Good Call.

I reckon that maxy will be the marking tall in defence more often than not.

Especialy when competing will the gorilla forwards.

He is then the get out target in the air.

Not get may wont hurt us as preuss is the man we needed

[beelzebub 22,225]

Despite any of the fluffy rhetoric about it's ok if Jesse is still at Melbourne in 19 it's a less than ideal result, if to be.

 

[John Demonic 4,781]

32 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Freo do have a way of getting Hogan and importantly still save face:  trade Neale to Brisbane, then include pick 5 in a trade to us.  They can save face by saying 'we now have the picks to satisfy Melb in a trade'.

But can't see them being smart or humble enough to be that sensible!

 

They traded pick 6 away to Port just to spite us and force us to accept 11+23 imo. Also to get Lobbe of course, but then they screwed him too and offered it to Tim Kelly. Doesnt make much sense to offer us 5 after all of that 

Edited October 12, 2018 by johndemonic

[What 18,810]

50 minutes ago, Wells 11 said:

For all of those wondering how Jesse will fit back in given he flirted with Freo,

Only a fool would wonder that.

After everything Jesses been through, how could anyone begrudge him at least looking into going back to his home town?

I hope hes a Demon for life, but I will not mind at all if he decides to go home to Perth.

Edited October 12, 2018 by Petraccattack

[pitmaster 3,050]

13 hours ago, #11-TonyAnderson said:

Wrapt that he is staying 

Agree with the sentiment, I think. But wrapt? No 'w' in enraptured which is the word you're abbreviating. Here endeth the lesson.

[Pates 9,536]

What’s interesting to hear is that even though statistically Hogan ranks above any of the best forwards at his age so many fans of other clubs don’t rate him. I understand his low output this year vs the better teams but his raw numbers are still something to behold. 

How so many fans don’t see him being worth pick 5 + 23 (or more imo) is beyond me. I know there are still people on here convinced he’s still being traded this period, I just don’t see how it happens with the way Freo have conducted themselves in these negotiations. Once this all wraps up (and we’re getting into 2019) I would love to hear from either Jesse or his manager to know what they’ve thought of Bell/Freo’s conduct. 

[Thehardtackler 785]

I think Melbourne will happily trade Jesse to West Coast in a year’s time. We will get proper compensation them. This was just about getting a fair deal. I think Jesse will be looked after and won’t begrudge the club a fair deal for losing him.

[Graeme Yeats' Mullet 6,267]

40 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

Despite any of the fluffy rhetoric about it's ok if Jesse is still at Melbourne in 19 it's a less than ideal result, if to be.

 

Yep, this whole excercise will have been bruising to say the least

[Dodos Demons 189]

21 minutes ago, johndemonic said:

They traded pick 6 away to Port just to spite us and force us to accept 11+23 imo. Also to get Lobbe of course, but then they screwed him too and offered it to Tim Kelly. Doesnt make much sense to offer us 5 after all of that 

The trade away of pick 6 is the most intriguing aspect of Freemantle’s behaviour:

1. Was it done in spite? Unlikely for a professional organisation but seems like Freo's current shot callers are out of their depth and not so professional (in the reason arena).

2. Was it done to get more picks to try and use them for both Lobb and Hogan thinking that their “tough” stance or negotiating skills will get those deals done? I suspect this is what Bell (and the board?) decided.

3. They asked Neale to wait (or Neale gave them an ultimatum) before pushing his move to Brisbane to allow them to try and get in Lobb and Hogan and Neale could reconsider? They got themselves in a bind as they don’t have the trade currency to get all these deals done to enable Neale to reconsider. 

4. They want to keep pick 5 (if they go it) for the draft so try and get Hogan cheaply? This is obviously a given. 

5. They thought Melbourne would accept their position that they no longer have pick 6 so can’t offer anything better than pick 11? Would be very naive of them to think his. Novice traders, so possible. Akin to negotiating skills of a kid in a school playground with his footy cards. 

6. Hogan has some “other issues” mental or otherwise and out of respect to Hogan they have not stated what they are but they only value him as worth a pick 11 and 2nd rounder? This is possible but we will never know. If this is their position then obviously all bets are off now and most likely the future to get Hogan. Could be a good outcome for Melbourne if they can resolve whatever the issues are. 

7. A combination of the above or something else? Who really know and will we ever know. 

Ar least our players did not do a Tex Walker towards Hogan (at least not public ally). Jesse seems very liked by the players so just hoping this does not damage relationships that impacts on our 2019 campaign. I am confident it won’t. 

[DeeZee 6,718]

I guess the question is, would you rather Jesse for one more year or May  and a pick for the next 5 or 6 years?

Jesse wants to go home, either this year or next.

[Gator 16,890]

5 hours ago, Fifty-5 said:

You've changed your tune.

Sure Hogan is open to a trade to Freo when they are offering him a long fat contract.  But the fact is, as you at least used to acknowledge, MFC has been in favour of trading him too this time and has been actively courting the idea.  It's not all or even mainly Hogan driving IMO.

I have no issue with this position of MFC and would be fine if he's traded for reasonable return like 5 + 23 that gets us May and makes us better - and it still could happen.  We're lucky to have a surplus of KPF talent, Hogan is the most tradable and saves long term salary cap that enables us to keep our other stars - the FD probably calculated that we can't keep them all.

Now Freo have forked this up totally and any resurrection of the trade is totally in their court on our terms.  In the absence of this we should actively turn it around to a positive with Hogan staying.  That's where we should get around him and play him in the backline in 2019.

Yep.

My take is that the club was happy to keep Hogan long-term, but not disappointed when he said he had a preference to return to Perth and specifically to go to the Fremantle Football Club.  As you know, the club is bullish about Weideman and Tom has become a revelation as a key forward.  Structurally, we're better with May in the 22 than with Hogan.  And yes, Hogan could become a quality key back, but I doubt he wants to move to defence.  Certainly not long-term.

More specifically, I cannot fathom why he'd go to a bottom 4-6 basket-case club, when we're on the precipice of a successful era.  It makes me question lots of things about him, including his drive and competitiveness.

“I asked him if he wanted to have a chat to Peter Bell and he said, ‘I don’t want to do it’.

“He said, ‘I will stay at Geelong or go to West Coast’. But I don’t want to go to a club down the bottom of the ladder because Geelong is a good club.

Tim Kelly gets it, as you can see by the quotes above.

If Hogan said his preference was to go to Freo, and I don't doubt it to be the case, then my whole view of him has changed.

Clearly, he's gone to the Jack Watts school of dedication.  And just as clearly, a flag means little to him.

I hope he's traded before Wednesday's deadline.

[jnrmac 18,914]

Freo have offered Geelong pick 11 for tim Kelly. Let that sink in.

they really are useless.

[Demon Premonition 135]

Lots of reading not a lot of posting.

I can’t see how Hogan gets to Freo cheaper than what is being offered this year next year.

As we understand at best he walks to the draft however I just can’t see Freo being any lower than around pick 4. 

The challenge for Freo is there well known home ground advantage will win them 5 or 6 games, a couple of surprise results and at 7 wins like this year they finish 14th or 15th. 

No way Hogan slips through to pick 5 in draft next year, so back to the trade table, however this time Josh Kennedy is a year older and West Coast will be working there numbers to be in the race.

My guess this is Freos best chance to land their forward, and won’t be surprised if deal still gets done.

[Hellaintabadplacetobe 4,089]

1 hour ago, Wells 11 said:

For all of those wondering how Jesse will fit back in given he flirted with Freo, imagine how it will be for Neale and Freo if they don’t trade him. Neale has  publically come out and said I don’t want to be at Freo next year! AND he’s a free agent at the end of 19. It’s way worse fr Freo and Neale than the dees and hogan.  Not out of the realms of possibility, if Bell doesn’t trade him,  that Neale consider sitting out fr the year. Hogan having an outstanding year, and Freo finishing bottom 3 with no Neale or hogan would be too delicious . 

Bryce Gibbs openly wanted to go to Crows in 2016 trade period and it fell on its arze. He had a pretty solid year for then finishing 4th in the bnf 2017. 

I'm sure there are many other examples of this happening. I expect Jesse to fit back in fine. 

The one thing that concerns was hearing Mike Sheehan say on radio yday say he would be happy with IN May OUT Hogan. To me it's a massive loss but Mike would know better than any journo out there. 

 

[chook fowler 18,170]

It would be interesting to know what the Freo fan forums are saying. Peter Bell sure has the little man syndrome- and this is coming from a little man.

The alpha dog is looking more like an omega.

Edited October 12, 2018 by chook fowler

[Dwight Schrute 16,722]

1 minute ago, chook fowler said:

It would be interesting what the Freo fan forums are saying. Peter Bell sure has the little man syndrome- and this is coming from a little man.

The alpha dog is looking more like an omega.

I can give you a summary 

- vic bias media 

-hogan always injured 

- dees asking way too much for hogan 

- he’s a free agent next year 

lots of absolute dribble.