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Changes v Port

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Posted (edited)

Can't agree with the numerous calls to drop Tracc, he really hasn't been that bad.

Taking contested marks, getting at least 15 touches, having a couple of really important involvements a game. Is he tearing the joint up? No. Do we believe he's capable of tearing the joint up? Absolutely.. and it appears this difference between current output and long term potential is why people are calling for him to be dropped.

Not a good enough reason in my eyes. 

I 100% want to see him play better, but he's far from our worst.

Edited by watchtheeyes
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12 hours ago, ProDee said:

Good post @stevethemanjordan.

The only area with which I disagree is Tyson.  He's a better inside mid than Nathan Jones.  While Jones is better on the outside. 

Move Jones to a more outside role and get Tyson into the team. 

I'd be happy to trial that, but not against Port. 

Ebert, Polec and Motlop are too fleet of foot for us to risk playing an inside mid on the wing. 

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Frost should come in for Pedersen and play as a defender/ruckman. This means TMac can play forward for a full game. If we play a forward/ruck, TMac plays 25% of the game on the wing so that our forward line is not overly tall. It also means that Lewis can play more minutes as a midfielder, where his lack of pace won't be exposed as badly. It also gives us more height and pace in defence. The negative is that it means we have another poor decision maker/kick in the backline (the other being Smith), but I think we need more athleticism down back given our mix of defenders.

Garlett to come in for Spargo. Garlett was almost All Australian last year and offers more than Spargo at his best.

Tyson could come into the side as well given his good VFL form. If so, I think Vince should may go out and Jones go to half back. IMO Tyson needs to play as an inside midfielder or not at all.

Petracca stays in the side.

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27 minutes ago, Fat Tony said:

Frost should come in for Pedersen and play as a defender/ruckman. This means TMac can play forward for a full game. If we play a forward/ruck, TMac plays 25% of the game on the wing so that our forward line is not overly tall. It also means that Lewis can play more minutes as a midfielder, where his lack of pace won't be exposed as badly. It also gives us more height and pace in defence. The negative is that it means we have another poor decision maker/kick in the backline (the other being Smith), but I think we need more athleticism down back given our mix of defenders.

Garlett to come in for Spargo. Garlett was almost All Australian last year and offers more than Spargo at his best.

Tyson could come into the side as well given his good VFL form. If so, I think Vince should may go out and Jones go to half back. IMO Tyson needs to play as an inside midfielder or not at all.

Petracca stays in the side.

Interesting idea with Frost. I don't completely hate it, but I also think it's not a long term option compared to settling a backline group with quality talent. Which to me is getting Petty in there and given Joel Smith more games to settle and really establishing a consistent group. Oscar will go to Dixon and I'm not sure there's a great match up for Frost. 

I can't see why Tommy Mc has to play wing to shrink the forward line if they go back to Tim Smith who provides the forward pressure. I also think Hogan should have a go on the wing not on the ball. When Westhoff is on the wing Hogan would be a good match up.

I can't see Lewis playing midfield again. His pace on the wing was shredded far worse than at was at half back when the right match up is there for him. And he doesn't have the explosiveness or desire to go in the guts any more. Half back is his best spot against the oppositions worst forward.

Garlett was something like AA form based on a number of good matches in the first half of last year. Hasn't played more than 1 or 2 good games since and hasn't done anything of note at Casey. I'd be giving Spargo a chance to bounce back after the bye. If there was a player to drop for Garlett it would be Hannan.

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On ‎6‎/‎13‎/‎2018 at 4:31 AM, Skuit said:

I've wanted to bring this up but couldn't be bothered with the likely blow-back. But I see you've been hinting around the edges Stretch, so here goes . . . 

Perhaps a silly fan perception, but I almost sensed that Viney was a bit lost on his return. When he put his head down to dig out the ball, Oliver and some other ursurpers were already there. He then seemed to step back a little, and it looked as if he was easing himself back in. Since then, he has returned to a primary extractor role, but now Oliver looks a bit frustrated and ANB and Harmes are suddenly down again - and Brayshaw, who was in top-notch form as a play-maker, has been shunted to a run-with role.

I don't want accuse JV of being a one-trick pony, but is primary strength is in burrowing under. We've switched our approach a bit since he was last in the team, from shutting down the stoppages to really getting the ball moving. Hence the blowouts for and against. Right now, Jack looks on the slow side, and I think has upset the mid-field balance a fraction.

It makes sense to want him back in the thick of it, because he is one of the league's best, and we need to back him in in the role, but the trust the running mids and half-backs have with Oliver isn't there yet with Viney. We were seriously sucked into the ball versus Collingwood. Jones too, seemed to have struggled on the weekend with the new mid-field mix and his own role.

I feel something right now has to give. Maybe Jones back to half-back to replace Vince, or Viney, who is a fantastic tagger, to swap with Brayshaw for the time being. We have ten or so weeks to get it right, but I think that sorting it out is absolutely critical to our ultimate chances to push deep into finals. When we break down in the middle - the cornerstone of our game - we get well and truly done.  

 

 

 

 

I would say that JV IS a one trick pony, nothing more nothing less!

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4 minutes ago, picket fence said:

I would say that JV IS a one trick pony, nothing more nothing less!

Very harsh on Viney he has an average game and your after him you didn't say that when he got 35 touches against Adelaide.

He is a gun. The whole midfield was down against the Pies watch them bounce back against Port.

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On ‎6‎/‎14‎/‎2018 at 10:51 PM, Fat Tony said:

Frost should come in for Pedersen and play as a defender/ruckman. This means TMac can play forward for a full game. If we play a forward/ruck, TMac plays 25% of the game on the wing so that our forward line is not overly tall. It also means that Lewis can play more minutes as a midfielder, where his lack of pace won't be exposed as badly. It also gives us more height and pace in defence. The negative is that it means we have another poor decision maker/kick in the backline (the other being Smith), but I think we need more athleticism down back given our mix of defenders.

Garlett to come in for Spargo. Garlett was almost All Australian last year and offers more than Spargo at his best.

Tyson could come into the side as well given his good VFL form. If so, I think Vince should may go out and Jones go to half back. IMO Tyson needs to play as an inside midfielder or not at all.

Petracca stays in the side.

When has a defender been used as a second ruck? He'll be a forward if he replaces Pedersen.

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Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, WERRIDEE said:

Very harsh on Viney he has an average game and your after him you didn't say that when he got 35 touches against Adelaide.

He is a gun. The whole midfield was down against the Pies watch them bounce back against Port.

Average pace, average disposal, doesn't hit scoreboard often enough, can get footy, that's about it! And nowhere near "Elite"

Edited by picket fence
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VIney hasn’t played to his best or even that close to it since his foot injury. He is however one of our best players and will continue to improve

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14 minutes ago, picket fence said:

Average pace, average disposal, doesn't hit scoreboard often enough, can get footy, that's about it! And nowhere near "Elite"

I've seen you post some drivel.

This takes the cake.

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On 6/14/2018 at 8:16 AM, ProDee said:

Good post @stevethemanjordan.

The only area with which I disagree is Tyson.  He's a better inside mid than Nathan Jones.  While Jones is better on the outside. 

Move Jones to a more outside role and get Tyson into the team. 

Tyson's not the future for us.   We need leg speed around the middle.

 

 He's in the 2's for a reason, to give him and the AFL world, a message.    Gun for hire!  will travel.

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Posted (edited)
On 6/14/2018 at 10:51 PM, Fat Tony said:

Frost should come in for Pedersen and play as a defender/ruckman. This means TMac can play forward for a full game. If we play a forward/ruck, TMac plays 25% of the game on the wing so that our forward line is not overly tall. It also means that Lewis can play more minutes as a midfielder, where his lack of pace won't be exposed as badly. It also gives us more height and pace in defence. The negative is that it means we have another poor decision maker/kick in the backline (the other being Smith), but I think we need more athleticism down back given our mix of defenders.

Garlett to come in for Spargo. Garlett was almost All Australian last year and offers more than Spargo at his best.

Tyson could come into the side as well given his good VFL form. If so, I think Vince should may go out and Jones go to half back. IMO Tyson needs to play as an inside midfielder or not at all.

Petracca stays in the side.

Frost played forward last game for Casey.  And surprisingly spotted up a 45` target, inside the 50 arc, with PREcision.

I was shocked.

 

But I reckon they are trying him out as a forward now, to workout the list management decisions for later in the year.

I was also thinking about him trying to take over Pedo's place as backup forward and follower.  He certainly has the pace to do a great job,,, 'IF',  he can start taking power marks around the ground.

Edited by DV8
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7 hours ago, picket fence said:

I would say that JV IS a one trick pony, nothing more nothing less!

If so, it's a pretty decent trick and I want him to be performing it for us for years to come. 

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8 hours ago, DV8 said:

Tyson's not the future for us.   We need leg speed around the middle.

 

 He's in the 2's for a reason, to give him and the AFL world, a message.    Gun for hire!  will travel.

Tyson is a better inside mid than Jones, no doubt about that statement. Jones' real strength on both sides is outside combined with running for space to deliver. Why someone from the FD does not take Tyson into a sustained 'delivery improvement' program I will never know - it is virtually his only weakness and he has the smarts to do something about it. 

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8 hours ago, DV8 said:

Frost played forward last game for Casey.  And surprisingly spotted up a 45` target, inside the 50 arc, with PREcision.

I was shocked.

Seen him do this several times, it is surprising because I thought that the coaches wanted him to be doing something else - run in possession, handball off, handball receive and progress, handball off. Then, regularly intercept and spoil. Then, take the big one-on-one mark in the backline. I went to a few pre-season hit-outs over the past couple of years and his foot passing was sharp, forward and in defence. Seldom have I seen this when he was playing in the ones. Strange? 

Now that the team is starting to utilise 'heads-up' progression in preference to the dreaded 'long bomb',  this aptitude may well be re-ignited in Frosty. 

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10 hours ago, WERRIDEE said:

Very harsh on Viney he has an average game and your after him you didn't say that when he got 35 touches against Adelaide.

He is a gun. The whole midfield was down against the Pies watch them bounce back against Port.

I agree. We don't need wholesale changes. The midfield just need to get their s#$t together.

Nothing works if we don't take advantage of Gawns work.

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Lin Jong running around Footscrays magoos a very  good player has pace , grunt, inside and outside skills! I reckon worth a look!

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Posted (edited)

In:  Smith,  Frost, Tyson and one of Jeffy / Bugg

Out:  Pedders, Vince*, Tracc*, Hannan

*Realistically i can't see these two being omitted.

Gus needs to start playing more time through the middle taking time off Chunk IMHO.  Chunk spends less time in the middle and more time resting at HF when Spargo is resting and a bit more time on the bench as a veteran.  It's time.  Gus is more capable of evading tackles and escaping a congested middle on either side of his body and hitting up targets inside 50 with either foot.

Tyson mostly off the bench but rotating with Gus a little through the middle and replacing Fritsch at HF when Fritsch is resting. Or Tracc if he keeps his place ahead of Tyson.  Tracc needs to be groomed into more of a big bodied running outside bias role (with some inside)  through the middle, taking over from Hulk who needs to play slightly closer to goal more of the time for structure and a few more inside 50 contested marks across HF.  We missed CHF target and general badly against the Pies IMO and it's time for him to start dominating and scoring here vs time through the middle.

No shut down roles from any of Gus, Clarry or Chunk pls.   ANB, Harmes and maybe a little of JV if needed in the square only.

 

 

Edited by Rusty Nails

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DV8,good one on Frost.  So we will have in our side "Hulk" Hogan, Mac attack and now Frosty "Miller" ( 4 all you kiddies out there,he was a  champion F.F 4 Dandenong in the old VFA).  Having said that should the Weed play defence/Ruck.

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Have a look at the ladder. To say this game is huge would be an understatement.  

A bunch of teams right behind us, and they are all playing bad teams next round. 

Finally  a great game on Friday Night footy.

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I would put Petracca on Ollie Wines and tell him its a close tag. If not then drop Petracca. But two things, we need to tag Wines IMO, he is by far their most damaging midfielder, and we can educate Petracca at the same time. Its out of left field, but Petracca needs education not to be dropped to Casey to dominate the learn nothing. In this circumstance we can kill two birds with the one stone. Let Viney and Oliver go head to head with Port's remaining two midfielders. They will steamroll straight through them.

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10 hours ago, picket fence said:

Lin Jong running around Footscrays magoos a very  good player has pace , grunt, inside and outside skills! I reckon worth a look!

Lin Jong for Viney, you heard it here first.

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Posted (edited)
14 minutes ago, KingDingAling said:

I would put Petracca on Ollie Wines and tell him its a close tag. If not then drop Petracca. But two things, we need to tag Wines IMO, he is by far their most damaging midfielder, and we can educate Petracca at the same time. Its out of left field, but Petracca needs education not to be dropped to Casey to dominate the learn nothing. In this circumstance we can kill two birds with the one stone. Let Viney and Oliver go head to head with Port's remaining two midfielders. They will steamroll straight through them.

I like this option King!  Wines is, by a country mile, their best player and in fab form right now.  My only issue is im not sure Tracc has the mental ability right now as he is very much in a loose checking mindset (mostly) and loves to receive and go on the outside.  I agree he needs educating though and play some more serious roles through the middle if he is to become a very good or great player vs just a handy one.

Also Nev on Motlop please, who is also having a very good run at the moment.

I still think we probably lose if we keep those two relatively quiet but the scoreboard (%) will be a little more respectable.  At the G it would be a coin flip.  The umps will give them at least 4 goals along the way (minimum) which will be the difference, even if we get the above right on the night.  If we don''t quieten those two and we leave the likes of Pedders / Hannan in i reckon we might be looking at 40 odd points.

Edited by Rusty Nails
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Posted (edited)

Polec, Wines, Dixon, R Gray, Westoff, Ryder, Wingard, Rockliff, Boak, SPP - it isn’t going to be easy and a huge test to see where we’re at 

Edited by SFebey
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28 minutes ago, KingDingAling said:

I would put Petracca on Ollie Wines and tell him its a close tag. If not then drop Petracca. But two things, we need to tag Wines IMO, he is by far their most damaging midfielder, and we can educate Petracca at the same time. Its out of left field, but Petracca needs education not to be dropped to Casey to dominate the learn nothing. In this circumstance we can kill two birds with the one stone. Let Viney and Oliver go head to head with Port's remaining two midfielders. They will steamroll straight through them.

Petracca doesn't have the engine to run with Wines

I prefer him as a permanent forward, staying close and leading the press in our forward line

If coaches still don't know how to win (games) or a flag (for that matter) in modern footy, they need to watch the Tige's win today

Numbers, numbers, numbers and more numbers

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