Jump to content

Discussion on recent allegations about the use of illicit drugs in football is forbidden
  • IMPORTANT: PLEASE READ BEFORE POSTING

    Posting unsubstantiated rumours on this website is strictly forbidden.

    Demonland has made the difficult decision to not permit this platform to be used to discuss & debate the off-field issues relating to the Melbourne Football Club including matters currently being litigated between the Club & former Board members, board elections, the issue of illicit drugs in footy, the culture at the club & the personal issues & allegations against some of our players & officials ...

    We do not take these issues & this decision lightly & of course we believe that these serious matters affecting the club we love & are so passionate about are worthy of discussion & debate & I wish we could provide a place where these matters can be discussed in a civil & respectful manner.

    However these discussions unfortunately invariably devolve into areas that may be defamatory, libelous, spread unsubstantiated rumours & can effect the mental health of those involved. Even discussion & debate of known facts or media reports can lead to finger pointing, blame & personal attacks.

    The repercussion is that these discussions can open this website, it’s owners & it’s users to legal action & may result in this website being forced to shutdown.

    Our moderating team are all volunteers & cannot moderate the forum 24/7 & as a consequence problematic content that contravenes our rules & standards may go unnoticed for some time before it can be removed.

    We reserve the right to delete posts that offend against our above policy & indeed, to ban posters who are repeat offenders or who breach our code of conduct.

    WE HAVE BUILT A FANTASTIC ONLINE COMMUNITY AT DEMONLAND OVER THE PAST 23 YEARS & WE WOULD LIKE TO CONTINUE TO BE ABLE TO DISCUSS THE CLUB WE LOVE & ARE SO PASSIONATE ABOUT.

    Thank you for your continued support & understanding. Go Dees.


The Most Talented List According to Champion Data


JAG007

Recommended Posts

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2018-01-16/revealed-the-afls-most-talented-list

The Tigers are ranked behind 2016 premiers the Western Bulldogs (No.7) and Hawthorn (No.8) and but they leapfrog both clubs when lists are narrowed to assess the best 22 players, jumping to seventh.

Sydney has the most talented full list as well as the best 22, while Port Adelaide comes in second for overall list strength after an aggressive off-season of recruiting, ahead of losing grand finalist Adelaide (No.3) and Greater Western Sydney (No.4).  

Sydney boasts an AFL-high 17 players rated either 'elite' or 'above average', ahead of Port Adelaide, which has 16 players in the top two categories.

Carlton's list is rated the least talented, while Fremantle has the weakest best 22, with captain Nat Fyfe rated as the club's only 'elite' player.   

Nathan Buckley will be attempting to steer Collingwood back into the finals with the 10th-ranked list, but the sixth-strongest best 22, with Essendon (11th overall) experiencing a similar spike to eighth when limited to its best 22.

I wonder where Melbourne's list will be compared to other clubs lists?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

18 minutes ago, DubDee said:

Its a disgrace that Sydney get propped out with equivalent no.1 draft picks when in the top 4 through the acadamies

The two sydney teams will be hard to beat over the next 5 years

That's the AFL's fault. Out of the $1bill plus tv rights they've had over the past 10 years they won't allocate money to identify and develop young talent in the non AFL States. They leave it entirely to the teams there even though with the expansion there is more need to find more players. The Swans have spent over $1mill per year on their Academy for about 8-10 years now. They seek out every junior athlete initially in the whole of NSW and since GWS in their allocated areas. They have around 500-600 players a year going through it, that's thousands and thousands of players over the period. Out of that massive investment, so far they have Heeney and Mills. That's it. Brandon Jack was the only other player to make it to the list and he didn't make it. Heeney was a rugby league player in Newcastle who would never have been discovered without the Swans Academy work in finding him. 

I was involved in Junior AFL in Sydney for over ten years and know how incredibly hard the landscape is up here for AFL. The Swans Academy is a big deal to all the kids up here who aspire to getting picked in it. I've watched its impact on Junior Clubs like ours since it started and its significant. 

The only way to solve this is for the AFL to set up AFL Academies not Club Academies. 

 

  • Like 6
  • Thanks 3
  • Love 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

57 minutes ago, Tony Tea said:

Apropos Champ Data. Does Collingwood still have the best rated on-ball brigade?

This year they have Collingwood listed as 6th strongest 'best 22' LOL

They are so bias towards the filth

  • Shocked 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites


4 hours ago, DubDee said:

Its a disgrace that Sydney get propped out with equivalent no.1 draft picks when in the top 4 through the acadamies

The two sydney teams will be hard to beat over the next 5 years

The Giants were apparently meant to win it the last two years.

  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

19 minutes ago, jnrmac said:

Jan 2017 Champion Data: Pies no 1 midfield Dees 18th

Grain. Of. Salt.

And remind me who won round 23?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 minutes ago, Diamond_Jim said:

I'm told that was an aberration after a long and difficult season......how did we lose ???

Funny how many clubs & supporters complain about long season, young lists, bad draws and sunspots. By and large the season length is basically the same, the average age of players at clubs 2018 oldest Adelaide & Hawthorn 24.6 the youngest GC 23.1- they're all young, good sides win with bad draws and who knows what sunspots do! It has to be the Norm Smith curse, I'm going out to sacrifice another chook, sheep (chops) and cows (steak) haven't worked yet.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

53 minutes ago, ManDee said:

Funny how many clubs & supporters complain about long season, young lists, bad draws and sunspots. By and large the season length is basically the same, the average age of players at clubs 2018 oldest Adelaide & Hawthorn 24.6 the youngest GC 23.1- they're all young, good sides win with bad draws and who knows what sunspots do! It has to be the Norm Smith curse, I'm going out to sacrifice another chook, sheep (chops) and cows (steak) haven't worked yet.

watch out for those venison steaks.... I am sure that sacrificing Bambi on the barbie cannot be good for us .. Then again I do like a good piece of 'Roo meat.

Edited by Diamond_Jim
  • Like 1
  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, ManDee said:

And remind me who won round 23?

That does not mean they are better then us, gee the eagles beat the crows in round 23, so that must mean they are better then them, in a season of 22 games we missed the finals by the smallest margin in history, and were in the 8 for most of the year they never got close to it, your response is what a four 4 year old would say.

  • Like 1
  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 minutes ago, old dee said:

There are two Statts I believe in from 2017.

Richmond were the best team and  Brisbane were the worst.

The rest is just Champion data trying to justify their existence.

I'm happy for them to count kicks and handballs too 'old dee', they can also give us the average age of the list etc.

Anything past that is all crystal balls to me...

Edited by rjay
  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites


37 minutes ago, rjay said:

I'm happy for them to count kicks and handballs too 'old dee', they can also give us the average age of the list etc.

Anything past that is all crystal balls to me...

Don't they always say on paper, but sport is not played on paper

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, don't make me angry said:

Don't they always say on paper, but sport is not played on paper

Not sure about that I reckon quite a few have paper for brains.

However you are correct, I have no idea how you quantify desire in the statts.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, old dee said:

Not sure about that I reckon quite a few have paper for brains.

However you are correct, I have no idea how you quantify desire in the statts.

Past performance don't dictate future performances, who could have predicted that Clayton would become one of the top 5 midfielders in the competition

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

These lists from Champion are inherently biased towards older lists.  They base their rankings on the team's performance over the past three seasons.  Many of our first side don't even have data from three seasons to put up, and certainly not impressive numbers in the firsts.  This doesn't mean that they aren't a better group than sides like Collingwood.  It's just that those sides are packed full of veterans with big numbers in the past to increase their ranking. 

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 1/17/2018 at 10:21 AM, It's Time said:

That's the AFL's fault. Out of the $1bill plus tv rights they've had over the past 10 years they won't allocate money to identify and develop young talent in the non AFL States. They leave it entirely to the teams there even though with the expansion there is more need to find more players. The Swans have spent over $1mill per year on their Academy for about 8-10 years now. They seek out every junior athlete initially in the whole of NSW and since GWS in their allocated areas. They have around 500-600 players a year going through it, that's thousands and thousands of players over the period. Out of that massive investment, so far they have Heeney and Mills. That's it. Brandon Jack was the only other player to make it to the list and he didn't make it. Heeney was a rugby league player in Newcastle who would never have been discovered without the Swans Academy work in finding him. 

I was involved in Junior AFL in Sydney for over ten years and know how incredibly hard the landscape is up here for AFL. The Swans Academy is a big deal to all the kids up here who aspire to getting picked in it. I've watched its impact on Junior Clubs like ours since it started and its significant. 

The only way to solve this is for the AFL to set up AFL Academies not Club Academies. 

 

completely agree.  I was having a go at the AFL not the sydney clubs. The AFL should 100% run and pay for these academies

it's an unfair advantage imo. Heeney and Mills are both worthy picks 1s and should have gone to struggling teams

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 hours ago, old dee said:

Not sure about that I reckon quite a few have paper for brains.

However you are correct, I have no idea how you quantify desire in the statts.

Tackles, tackle percentage, 1 percenters like smothers and spoils, contested ball and now the all important pressure acts that attempts to grade how much pressure a player applies to an opponent. Combine that with GPS numbers and I think it probably does spit out a decent evaluation of which players are doing what in the old days would be called 'running hard and having a crack'.

If there's a glaring weakness in using stats to evaluate footy games it's that they can't say which players are running to and disposing to the right spots according to a coaches game plan. In fact I doubt think Champion Data have even worked out what they would rank as the best game plan. 

They should focus their stats on the ones that matter and on which players matter.

They might well do that and keep it in house for the clubs because the stuff they release to the media is just a statistical version of fan forum rankings.

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, DeeSpencer said:

Tackles, tackle percentage, 1 percenters like smothers and spoils, contested ball and now the all important pressure acts that attempts to grade how much pressure a player applies to an opponent. Combine that with GPS numbers and I think it probably does spit out a decent evaluation of which players are doing what in the old days would be called 'running hard and having a crack'.

If there's a glaring weakness in using stats to evaluate footy games it's that they can't say which players are running to and disposing to the right spots according to a coaches game plan. In fact I doubt think Champion Data have even worked out what they would rank as the best game plan. 

They should focus their stats on the ones that matter and on which players matter.

They might well do that and keep it in house for the clubs because the stuff they release to the media is just a statistical version of fan forum rankings.

We are in 100% agreement on that one DS.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Unfortunately, your content contains terms that we do not allow. Please edit your content to remove the highlighted words below.
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
  • Demonland Forums  

  • Match Previews, Reports & Articles  

    GAMEDAY: Rd 03 vs Port Adelaide

    It's Game Day and the Demons begin their 2 week adventure in South Australia tonight when they face the Power from Port at the Adelaide Oval. Both teams will be keen to stamp their early credentials for September in this Top 4 clash on the big stage.

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 2

    DEPTH CHARGE by Whispering Jack

    The jubilation on the coach’s face as he danced a celebratory jig by the playing bench after the final siren sounded to record his team’s four-point victory over the Demons when the teams last met, said it all.    On that rainy Friday night at the Adelaide Oval, Ken Hinkley’s young midfield secured much more than four points on offer. The victory over one of the big dogs of the competition after a succession of wins over some of its lesser lights gave his team respect and validation fo

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 5

    TRAINING: Monday 25th March 2024

    Demonland Trackwatchers Demon Dynasty & Kev Martin were trackside at Gosch's Paddock today to bring you their observations from training. DEMON DYNASTY'S TRAINING OBSERVATIONS Kade Chandler's left knee heavily strapped. BBB, Spargs & Jake Lever also in rehab group. Jake Bowey solo running separate kicking/sprint/agility drills. Super fine morning / early arvo at Gosch's for the boys to blow out some cobwebs. Choco initially had the light duties / rehab group

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Training Reports

    HIBERNATING by KC from Casey

    When they locked up the rooms for summer at the end of last year’s football season, the rooms gathered cobwebs, the atmosphere became dense and the place developed a sleepy feel. They opened up the rooms to let Casey out to play on Sunday but the team was still hibernating and they missed the bulk of the opening quarter. By the time they worked out it was game on, their opponents from Box Hill had accumulated five goals and, if the game wasn’t over, it might as well have been. For a se

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Casey Articles

    A FORK IN THE HAWK by George on the Outer

    For too long in the past, Demon fans became habitually sick and tired of watching the Hawks hand out thrashings to their side. But Melbourne’s empahtic 55-point win at the MCG on Saturday has truly put a fork in the Hawk and turned that history well and truly on its head. The Demons have now won nine of their last ten encounters with the other result, a draw.     And like a fork, it was the multi-pronged options that Melbourne had all across the ground.  It certainly helped that Hawthorn

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Reports 8

    PREGAME: Rd 03 vs Port Adelaide

    The Demons head on the road for the next 2 weeks as they travel to Adelaide to play Port on Saturday and then have a 5 Day break before facing the Crows in the Gather Round. With injuries to May and Lever who comes in and who goes out?

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 279

    PODCAST: Rd 02 vs Hawthorn

    The Demonland Podcast will air LIVE on Monday, 25th March @ 8:30pm. Join George, Binman & I as we analyse the Demons victory at the MCG against the Hawks in the Round 02. You questions and comments are a huge part of our podcast so please post anything you want to ask or say below and we'll give you a shout out on the show. If you would like to leave us a voicemail please call 03 9016 3666 and don't worry no body answers so you don't have to talk to a human. Listen & Chat

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 46

    VOTES: Rd 02 vs Hawthorn

    Last week Steven May took the lead in the Demonland Player of the Year Award from Jack Viney. Clayton Oliver & Max Gawn round out the Top 4. Your votes for the win/loss against/to the Hawks. 6, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1.

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 50

    POSTGAME: Rd 02 vs Hawthorn

    The Demons cruised to an easy 55 point win over the Hawks at the MCG but but paid a heavy toll on the injury front with Steven May & Jake Lever possibly sidelined for a number of weeks.

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 363
  • Tell a friend

    Love Demonland? Tell a friend!

  • Podcast 

  • Podcast 

  • Podcast Stream 


    Open Stream in
    New Window
        TuneIn    Opens in New Tab
  • Support Demonland  



  • 2021 Premiership  

  • Social Media 

  • Non MFC Games  

    NON-MFC: Round 03

    Discussion of all the other games that don't involve the Demons in Round 03 ... READ MORE

    Demonland | Round 03

  • Game Day      

    GAMEDAY: Round 03 vs Port Adelaide

    It's Game Day and the Demons begin their 2 week adventure in South Australia tonight when they face the Power from Port at the Adelaide Oval. Both teams will be keen to stamp their early credentials for September in this Top 4 clash on the big stage ... READ MORE

    Demonland | March 30

  • Match Preview      

    DEPTH CHARGE by Whispering Jack

    The jubilation on the coach’s face as he danced a celebratory jig by the playing bench after the final siren sounded to record his team’s four-point victory over the Demons when the teams last met, said it all ... READ MORE

    Demonland | March 27

  • Latest Podcast      

    PODCAST: Rd 02 vs Hawthorn

    The boys dissected the clinical thrashing of Hawks praising the immense performance of Christian Petracca whilst lamenting the injury toll to our defensive unit ... LISTEN

    Demonland | March 26

  • Training  

    Monday, 25th March 2024

    Demonland Trackwatchers Demon Dynasty & Kev Martin were trackside at Gosch's Paddock today to bring you their observations from training ... READ MORE

    Demonland | March 25

  • Casey Report      

    HIBERNATING by KC from Casey

    When they locked up the rooms for summer at the end of last year’s football season, the rooms gathered cobwebs, the atmosphere became dense and the place developed a sleepy feel. They opened up the rooms to let Casey out to play on Sunday but the team was still hibernating and they missed the bulk of the opening quarter ... READ MORE

    Demonland | March 25

  • PreGame      

    PREGAME: Rd 03 vs Port Adelaide

    The Demons head out on the road for the next 2 weeks as they travel to Adelaide to play Port on Saturday and then have a 5 Day break before facing the Crows in Gather Round. With injuries to May and Lever who comes in and who goes out? ...READ MORE

    Demonland | March 28

  • Match Report      

    A FORK IN THE HAWK by George on the Outer

    For too long in the past, Demon fans became habitually sick and tired of watching the Hawks hand out thrashings to their side. But Melbourne’s empahtic 55-point win at the MCG on Saturday has truly put a fork in the Hawk and turned that history well and truly on its head ... READ MORE

    Demonland | March 23

  • Post Game      

    POSTGAME: Rd 02 vs Hawthorn

    The Demons cruised to an easy 55 point win over the Hawks at the MCG but but paid a heavy toll on the injury front with Steven May & Jake Lever possibly sidelined for a number of weeks ...READ MORE

    Demonland | March 23

  • Votes      

    VOTES: Rd 02 vs Hawthorn

    Last week Steven May took the lead in the Demonland Player of the Year Award from Jack Viney. Clayton Oliver & Max Gawn round out the Top 4. Your votes for the win/loss against/to the Hawks. 6, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1 ...READ MORE

    Demonland | March 23

  • Training  

    Friday, 22nd March 2024

    Demonland Trackwatcher Kev Martin and I attended the Captain's Run at Gosch's Paddock on this lovely sunny morning to bring you the following observations from the training session ... READ MORE

    Demonland | March 22

  • Training  

    Tuesday, 19th March 2024

    Demonland Trackwatchers Kev Martin & Walking Civil War attended Tuesday morning's training session at Gosch's Paddock to bring you the following observations ... READ MORE

    Demonland | March 19

  • Training  

    Saturday, 16th March 2024

    Demonland Trackwatchers Kev Martin and Dee Zephyr wandered down to Gosch's Paddock on Saturday morning to bring you their observations from the Captain's Run in the lead up to Sunday's Round One match against the Bulldogs ... READ MORE

    Demonland | March 16

  • Farewell  

    Angus Brayshaw Retires

    After 167 games including the drought breaking Premiership Angus Brayshaw has made the heart breaking decision to medically retire from football as a result of a series of serious head knocks over his nearly decade of footy. We wish Gus all the best and he'll always be a hero at Demonland ... READ MORE

    Demonland | February 22

  • Latest Podcast  

    PODCAST: Koltyn Tholstrup Interview

    I interview the Melbourne Football Club’s newest recruit Koltyn Tholstrup to have a chat about his journey from the farm to the Demons, his first few weeks of preseason training, which Dees have impressed him on the track and his aspirations of playing Round 1 ... LISTEN

    Demonland | December 14

  • Latest Podcast  

    PODCAST: Jason Taylor Interview

    I interview the Melbourne Football Club's National Recruitment Manager Jason Taylor to have a chat about our Trade and Draft period, our newest recruits, our recent recruits who have yet to debut as well as those father son prospects on the horizon ... LISTEN

    Demonland | November 27

  • Next Match 

    .

    Round 03

       vs   

    Saturday 30th March 2024
    @ 07:30pm (AO)

  • MFC Forum  

  • Match Previews & Reports  

  • Training Forum  

  • AFLW Forum  

  • 2024 Player Sponsorship

  • Topics

  • Injury List  


      PLAYER INJURY LENGTH
    Jake Lever Knee Test
    Clayton Oliver Hand Test
    Oliver Sestan Concussion Test
    Steven May Ribs 1 Week
    Lachie Hunter Calf 1 Week
    Daniel Turner Hip 2-3 Weeks
    Charlie Spargo Achilles 2-4 Weeks
    Shane McAdam Hamstring 3-5 Weeks
    Jake Bowey Shoulder 7 Weeks
    Jake Melksham ACL 12-14 Weeks
    Joel Smith Suspension TBA

  • Player of the Year  


        PLAYER VOTES
    1 Christian Petracca 27
    2 Steven May 25
    3 Max Gawn 21
    4 Jack Viney 20
    5 Bayley Fritsch 19
    6 Clayton Oliver 18
    7 Christian Salem 12
    8 Blake Howes 11
    9 Jack Billings 10
    9 Alex Neal-Bullen 10

        FULL TABLE
  • Demonland Interviews 



  • Upcoming Events 

×
×
  • Create New...