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Trade Jack Watts or not?  

475 members have voted

  1. 1. Do we trade Jack Watts?

    • Yes.
      142
    • No.
      311


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1 minute ago, Roger Bonnici said:

I'm surprised your aware of such a make, shows your ignorance surely Demonland can do better than your type

Me being aware of the existence of Range Rovers shows my ignorance. Got it. 

"Better than your type" haha, it gets better.

How was the snow at Bulla this season?
 

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14 minutes ago, Roger Bonnici said:

Jack Watts is gone why don't we close this post and give the guy some respect. I have followed Melbourne for 55 years and been a member for 38 consecutive years, my heart once beat true for the red and blue now the only game I will attend in 2018, wherever it will be  Melbourne vs Port Adelaide I will wear my red and blue attire barrack like hell on earth for Jack Watts hope he kicks a bag then I'll walk away. Oh, also hope this is the beginning of the end for Goodwin that I would like to see 

Pathetic. The club is bigger than the individual.

You're probably the guy who said he was so disappointed in Melbourne that he hoped Port would win the flag next year. 

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Quite happy for Jack to be traded but really object to the return in terms of the pick gained and livid at us having to pay part of his salary. I don't buy a membership and raffle tickets etc to subsidise opposition players. Someone needs to be held accountable for this. Pick 31 better land us a gem.

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1 hour ago, ChewyOnMyBoot said:

 

Wow. Some on here are, surprisingly, pretty sensitive. Happy to dish it out but not quite able to take it? You guys need a man hug! 

Despite what you think I have little issue with Jack going. It could have been good for both the club and for Jack. A win win as they say. Sadly, Melbourne have stuffed it up badly. Good clubs, with healthy culture, do it with respect. Melbourne have butchered it worse than a Viney pass into the forward line.

Obviously time will tell. 

Way to change the goal posts. You intimated the playing group would be upset with the departure of Watts. I merely pointed out the playing group doesn't seem that upset and are on board to have a crack at September in 2018.

Best wishes Jack, now we get back to work. 

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A charming, charismatic guy. A wonderful sportsman and good bloke. Earning top $$$ doing what he loves. But the $$$ stops with Goodwin and he has made a judgement call, that's what he's paid to do. Good luck to Jack,will always remember you icing it v. The pies, erasing the memory of your first game where you were put in before you were ready.

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I must admit my memory is fading in my old age, but I’m fairly certain Watts booted 5 in the vfl the week before or leading up to his afl debut

Can anyone confirm?

I remember at the time there was a fair bit of clamoring to get him in

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4 minutes ago, DemonAndrew said:

I must admit my memory is fading in my old age, but I’m fairly certain Watts booted 5 in the vfl the week before or leading up to his afl debut

Can anyone confirm?

I remember at the time there was a fair bit of clamoring to get him in

No more clamoring now

There was more rooting for Ben Ken - how did that turn out?

Oh....wait....

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1 hour ago, TGR said:

What was Mark Neeld?  Garry Lyon's safe and easy pick because Mick gave him a reference.

You can be lectured about Garry's thoughts.  I won't be.

FCS, we are paying some of Watts' wage?  It only gets better.  The MFC are paying Jordan Lewis' super; Watts' holiday, and over-compensated Adelaide too early. 

Strikes me of a club that is insecure, without much nerve.

Wrong take I reckon TGR.  Whilst the majority here think we are soft and can't negotiate I reckon we've had the balls to see what we need and go and get it.  We've not been worried about the marginal costs of playing top dollar for what we need.  We've not been worried that the journo's and keyboard warriors will ridicule us for paying "overs" or taking "unders".

The safe thing would have been to say Lever was overs and Watts was unders and not do the deal.  If we did that we'd be playing with a list we saw as inadequate.  The courageous thing to do was to pay what it took and risk being wrong.  Many a sook here would lament finishing 4th in a few years wishing we had a Lever to solidify the backline.

This FD have a vision and are following it fearlessly.  They aren't taking the easy option.  Good on them.

As for Watts I regret what we've done to a rare person in footy because Jack is a decent, honest and loyal person dealt cards that cruelled him.  Good luck Jack, I'll always wish you the best and always feel we've let you down very badly.

 

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There's a list of about 50 people on this site that thought Watts would still stay and this was all just deliberate commotion to give jack a kick up the backside.LOL! I would go back and list them all but, seriously, it showed a serious lack of understanding of how you value watts,  what the MFC is trying to achieve and just the footy landscape in general. Embarrassing. 'Bring back Powell' you were a repeat offender. 

I also got shot down for suggesting a straight swap for pick 31. Well turns out I was right and i value Watts to the same degree as the coaches and footy department that know his deficiencies the best.
 

 

 

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3 minutes ago, DemonAndrew said:

I must admit my memory is fading in my old age, but I’m fairly certain Watts booted 5 in the vfl the week before or leading up to his afl debut

Can anyone confirm?

 

Along with memory loss, another symptom of old age can be strange, distant reminiscings. :P

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2 minutes ago, Dr.D said:

There's a list of about 50 people on this site that thought Watts would still stay and this was all just deliberate commotion to give jack a kick up the backside.LOL! I would go back and list them all but, seriously, it showed a serious lack of understanding of how you value watts,  what the MFC is trying to achieve and just the footy landscape in general. Embarrassing. 'Bring back Powell' you were a repeat offender. 

I also got shot down for suggesting a straight swap for pick 31. Well turns out I was right and i value Watts to the same degree as the coaches and footy department that know his deficiencies the best.
 

 

 

You're a genius

Wanna add me on Facey?

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43 minutes ago, Ungarie boy said:

Okay some perspective on trade value, it would seem:

* Multiple all Australian players still in there prime = 2 first rounders, at least one pre-teen
* Likely multiple all Australian players approaching their prime * 2 first rounders
* All Australian - 1 first rounder
* Club top 5 player - mid first rounder 
* regular top 10 player - late first rounder
* Walkup starting 18 - early second rounder
* starting 22 player - second rounder
* fringe 22 player - late second round / third round rounder
* ressie player with AFL gametime - third rounder
* Ressie player with potential - late third rounder
* Approaching retirement leadership player - fourth round rounder
* Career resurrection player - packet of chips
* Risk players - peanuts

Of course this is a generalisation as injury, game role (key position, ruck, outside/inside,), team requirements, age, etc,  can all shift things a little; but as a guide where would Watts fit in.
Also note the guide is based on current years form, with previous years normally only taken into account when injury, trauma, etc need to be considered.

Well at the end of this season you could not honestly state that Watts was a walkup starting 18 player; so that's a starting point.  Add to this his current career trajectory which has flatlined (or started going the other way); the question then gets asked how many more years are likely left in him at his best output (this would probably at best equal a "walkup starting 18 player")

Now like others I don't like getting pick 31.  As I feel, believe and even think that he is a better player; but  the reality is he is not, he might be, but history also suggest he will not be.  I also know, like Travis Johnstone at Brisbane,  he will win Port some games, and be applauded; but in all likelihood finish his onfield career in a similar pattern. I hope not, as I want to see him succeed; even if it is at Port.

Still on analysis, the reality is 31 is not wide of the mark!!!!  

A question that is not being asked though, is why after8 years of averageness; he got such a good contact.

P.s Don't judge him and this trade on his silky skills, charisma and "what could be"; Other clubs have not.  Judge this on where he currently is at,and what he has demonstrated - again it is what other clubs are doing.  This will help understand and possibly placate the trade outcome.

 

 

 

 

Do I wish we got more than 31, of course, but 31 looks good when you consider we got Hibbered for 29 or there abouts

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2 hours ago, TGR said:

Where did Lever finish in the B&F this year?

 

B&F's are tainted my friend.  A tool of vindication used by coaches and the FD.

Two things:

1. It wasn't my post you were responding to, so your manipulation of the quote is duplicitous.

2. The B&F is the best measure of how the coaching staff view a player because only they know what he is instructed to do, whether it is done under injury duress and how successful he is against is task.

Watts played more games thatn Pederson and Salem and yet was beaten in the B&F. That tells me a few things.

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6 minutes ago, --coach-- said:

Do I wish we got more than 31, of course, but 31 looks good when you consider we got Hibbered for 29 or there abouts

Are Ess paying his chit ?

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2 hours ago, TGR said:

What was Mark Neeld?  Garry Lyon's safe and easy pick because Mick gave him a reference.

 

You can be lectured about Garry's thoughts.  I won't be.

 

 

FCS, we are paying some of Watts' wage?  It only gets better.  The MFC are paying Jordan Lewis' super; Watts' holiday, and over-compensated Adelaide too early. 

 

Strikes me of a club that is insecure, without much nerve.

Yawn😴

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6 minutes ago, jnrmac said:

Two things:

1. It wasn't my post you were responding to, so your manipulation of the quote is duplicitous.

2. The B&F is the best measure of how the coaching staff view a player because only they know what he is instructed to do, whether it is done under injury duress and how successful he is against is task.

Watts played more games thatn Pederson and Salem and yet was beaten in the B&F. That tells me a few things.

You are duplicitous

There was a time, that I can so fondly remember, when you held the B & F in the same high esteem as Colin Sylvia

Keep up the good work

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Is there snow anywhere in Australia atm?

I would even settle for a bucket full of shaved ice.

Anything to escape the Jupiter-sized gravity pull of this godawful thread.

 

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20 minutes ago, jnrmac said:

Two things:

1. It wasn't my post you were responding to, so your manipulation of the quote is duplicitous.

2. The B&F is the best measure of how the coaching staff view a player because only they know what he is instructed to do, whether it is done under injury duress and how successful he is against is task.

Watts played more games thatn Pederson and Salem and yet was beaten in the B&F. That tells me a few things.

Gosh jnr, you needed to go to the B&F to see what the coaching staff thought of Watts?

I got a pretty good idea when they put him up for trade with two years to run on his contract.

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https://www.3aw.com.au/jack-watts-says-its-been-an-emotional-few-weeks-following-his-trade-to-port-adelaide/

I'd recommend listening to this interview from this morning. Such a great guy and only wished the best for the club. 

None of us can comment yet whether this was or wasn’t the right decision by the club – this time next year we should. However, I think it is fair to say that it is all a very sad situation. He loved the club and wanted to stay, but the coaches didn’t see him being part of the success the hopefully not-so-distant future entails. I hope they are right that Watts might have been the anchor keeping us at the shore, but I am not convinced.

Good luck, Wattsy, and thanks for everything! Go Dees

 

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Jack Watts:  "Reading the comments and the messages I've been getting, it's been extremely humbling, but at the same time, Melbourne are on the right track and hopefully the supporters can see past this and jump back on board and support the club through what hopefully is a really successful time for them."

After all the public critique of him by our leaders, to find the goodwill to give the above message to fans - well it just doesn't get any classier!   

Go well, young man. 

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Disappointed to see him leave, but more so disappointed that Jack has seemingly cruised through 2017 and obviously didn't uphold his end of the bargain with the coaching group. My prediction is he'll be struggling to get a regular game at Port.

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45 minutes ago, --coach-- said:

Interesting that JW now says (Herald Sun reporting) he saw this comming.

yep, finally saw it coming about 48 hours ago

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16 hours ago, ProDee said:

You do realise that every pick after 31 was also available ?  That there was a huge pool of players beyond that and that they're just the players selected at that number ?

This is a needlessly gratuitous post. How is it productive to post this stuff?

Everyone here knows the currency of pick 31 - I expect the original post was intended to illustrate the historical value of pick 31, which is not great. That elite players might've been picked up after it from time to time is widely known and not worthy of a response like this. It's just divisive.

That some people have 'liked' it though illustrates how unnecessarily partisan this 'debate' has become. It's like observing the masses in a fairground in Manassas, Virginia, roar in furious acceptance of anything Trump has to say on anything. They simply believe in the quest.

Many here have argued (correctly in my view) that pick 31 reflects Watts' current trade value.

For an experienced and skilled player, who only last year knocked back several other clubs to then sign a 3 year deal with the MFC on very good terms, pick 31 is an indictment. On Watts. I've come to side with this view.

I think the club has however handled this situation very poorly. To date at least. I hope the club now seeks to re-built some trust with a sizeable chunk of its supporter base (and possibly some players), and we now set sail for the top 4 in 2018.

No doubt this will attract some jerky responses from the usual suspects, but I simply cannot see how this is a remotely remarkable (or controversial) view to hold in the circumstances.

 

 

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