POST MATCH DISCUSSION - Round 6

[Stinga2 194]

Jordan Lewis has a 100% win record for the dees

[Webber 10,010]

6 hours ago, A F said:

Just watched the replay and the commentators got stuck into him as well. He undoes so much of his good work with horrible decision making and dreadful kicking. 

He was really important last week with his intercept marking, but this week he was a bit of a liability.

10-15,000. There were 44,000 there. They had 30,000-35,000.

Agreed. His kicking actually seems to be getting worse. Won't get dropped after collecting 29, but as soon as he fails to gather a lot of it, I'd send him back to Casey to work on his kicking. He did kick a perfect pass to Trac for his last goal - kicked it goalside for once. But yeah, really struggling with his kicking.

 

Jon Ralph in the little right wing rag gave Tom MacDonald the 3 votes, Dom Tyson had 29 possessions as you state, but also had a booming 637 metres gained (the most for either team, and yes, not all of them hit their target; 69% disposal efficiency). Jayden Hunt was next for us with 465, nobody else even in the 400's. Yeah yeah yeah, neither are perfect players, their foibles are frustrating, but that's football. Neither are anywhere near being de-selected, because as Simon Goodwin, the rest of the coaching staff and the players keep telling us, whether we understand it or not (many on here don't), they play their roles to a high team standard. Congrats on the life commitment AF, for better or worse, and all that good stuff. 

[Forest Demon 4,681]

Ordinary game, but we did enough. Take the 4 points and move on.

Funnily enough, the short break didn't do Collingwood much harm.

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,394]

13 hours ago, Danelska said:

So are you satisfied nor not? I'm confused....

I think BB is very satisfied...with himself for his first four lines.

[pineapple dee 2,892]

18 hours ago, Bitter but optimistic said:

GuzzLG

2h

 

Oliver > Parish

Just took the above gem of Bomberblitz.

Gotta love it.

You've gotta love Bomberblitz. Great light entertainment especially after a loss to the dees. My favourite quote from yesterday.........  "Zaharakis is like a one trick pony who's forgotten the trick."

[old55 21,271]

8 hours ago, A F said:

From an intensity perspective, Jack Watts was very, very ordinary. He played from behind, failed to tackle stronger and probably went at about 10% all day. But he's a clever, skilful player and things went his way today.

Gratuitous sledge.

Watts fumbled a couple of times but was generally excellent and led an undersized forward line.  He kicked 4.1.  He rucked without relief for 3 quarters in the wet just 5.5 days ago.  It's some sort of miracle he got up for the game at all.

[leave it to deever 15,317]

11 hours ago, Rusty Nails said:

A nice pick up. Pitty we couldn't have retained Dunn & Howe in favour of Melk amd O-Mac. Both a fair way ahead of these two, even if they look uglier in B&W.

Yea but I still think O mac will be very good in 2 years and Howe was tad  lazy.

[Binmans PA 25,997]

2 hours ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

@A FBy my reckoning you were posting on DL at about 3.30 AM the night after your wedding, after spending the day at the football with your mates...

...and you are taking her to watch the Hawks lose.

Good Lord!  I wouldn't push your luck with the lovely lady...

Indeed, mate. I had to watch the replay before sleep time and naturally had to read the post match thread.  She's good like that.

[Binmans PA 25,997]

1 hour ago, Webber said:

Jon Ralph in the little right wing rag gave Tom MacDonald the 3 votes, Dom Tyson had 29 possessions as you state, but also had a booming 637 metres gained (the most for either team, and yes, not all of them hit their target; 69% disposal efficiency). Jayden Hunt was next for us with 465, nobody else even in the 400's. Yeah yeah yeah, neither are perfect players, their foibles are frustrating, but that's football. Neither are anywhere near being de-selected, because as Simon Goodwin, the rest of the coaching staff and the players keep telling us, whether we understand it or not (many on here don't), they play their roles to a high team standard. Congrats on the life commitment AF, for better or worse, and all that good stuff. 

Interesting hearing Tom get the votes. Also interesting that Dom was cleaner in the wet on Monday night. Maybe it was the 5 day break? 

And thanks for the well wishes, mate.

[old55 21,271]

2 hours ago, Diamond_Jim said:

I have been enjoying the read on Bomber blitz about the game.

The main thing I took away from it was that the Bomber fans do not rate us as a team. Hopefully the next year is about getting us some respect in the general football community.

On a more interesting note here is an extract from an insightful post looking at the game from a Bomber viewpoint:

I was (un)fortunate enough to watch the Carlton game from L2 at the MCG.

Today, I thought we were in trouble in the first 90 seconds of the game when Melbourne set up a zone defence exactly the same as Carlton did - and I mean almost exactly. Namely, stronger concentration in the corridor but allowing us to go wide if we wanted coming out of defence

Like the game Carlton game - and without the excuse of poor conditions - we did exactly that. Rarely trying to use running players to cut through the zone or try and hit up passes. Instead we went slow and wide with short passes and the player marking near the boundary then didn't even try and find someone in-board and just bombed it down the line....where of course it came back with interest. This all happened at the end of Q2 on Anzac Day. It was best illustrated in Q4 (I think) when we tried to switch and Hurley received it just inside D50. He already had Gleeson out wide and went to him - he hadn't bothered looking inboard to the point of the centre square where Heppell, unopposed had led to. Well Gleeson marked it out wide and showed no urgency at all so the Melbourne players pushed up and blocked the paces....until Jobe pushed through just forward of the wing for what would have been an easy 15m pass inboard and forward and Gleeson totally ignored him.

Gleeson just bombed it long down the line and of course we were outnumbered and the Demons swept the ball away and scored. This is precisely what happened against Carlton time and time again and today was a straight repeat. The players gradually lost confidence and some of the skill errors were as a result of not having options and not knowing what to do. Only McGrath & McKenna actually tried to run and break the lines hit up options (not always successfully) and it's run from behind that breaks up zones - just like at the start of Q4 on Anzac Day when two early Pie behinds resulted in coast-to-coast goals for us because Goddard & Merrett hit targets on the kick-outs who quickly handballed to a running player from behind who cut through the Collingwood players and opened the game up.

After half-time the Demons got right on top in clearances and that contributed to the score blowing out.

https://discourse.bomberblitz.com/t/review-vs-dees-melk-and-hibberd-vindication/10370/179

I don't agree with that at all, I thought Essendon tried to switch into the corridor from HB a lot and mostly it came off.  Goddard particularly did this well.  It was their next play that let them down with turnovers.

From our point of view, I thought the coaching panel did a great job with the ruck coverage having Pedersen take the majority with only short relief from Watts who played well forward, bringing in Oscar so that TMac could take the back 50 contests was a great plan.  Pedersen and our midfield did a great job at the stoppages but this is not the greatest threat not having a ruckman.  The kick down the line is the greatest threat and Essendon failed to exploit that - Bellchambers and Daniher towered over us in this area and they couldn't use it.  This is where we are vulnerable in future.  When we have it in defence we don't have the down the line get out if their ruckman can mark well, so we HAVE to find the spot up or the switch.  When they have it they always have the down the line get out if their ruckman is competitive in the air.  In future we really need to get TMac up to those contests to at least nullify their ruckman.

 

Edited May 1, 2017 by Fifty-5

[old55 21,271]

2 hours ago, Webber said:

Jon Ralph in the little right wing rag gave Tom MacDonald the 3 votes, Dom Tyson had 29 possessions as you state, but also had a booming 637 metres gained (the most for either team, and yes, not all of them hit their target; 69% disposal efficiency). Jayden Hunt was next for us with 465, nobody else even in the 400's. Yeah yeah yeah, neither are perfect players, their foibles are frustrating, but that's football. Neither are anywhere near being de-selected, because as Simon Goodwin, the rest of the coaching staff and the players keep telling us, whether we understand it or not (many on here don't), they play their roles to a high team standard. Congrats on the life commitment AF, for better or worse, and all that good stuff. 

Agree.  It will be very interesting to see the coaches votes.  They are what really counts.

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,394]

1 minute ago, Fifty-5 said:

I don't agree with that at all, I thought Essendon tried to switch into the corridor from HB a lot and mostly it came off.  Goddard particularly did this well.  It was their next play that let them down with turnovers.

From our point of view, I thought the coaching panel did a great job with the ruck coverage having Pedersen take the majority with only shortrelief from Watts who played well forward, bringing in Oscar so that TMac could take the back 50 contests was a great plan.  Pedersen and our midfield did a great job at the stoppages but this is not the greatest threat not having a ruckman.  The kick down the line is the greatest threat and Essendon failed to exploit that - Bellchambers and Daniher towered over us in this area and they couldn't use it.  This is where we are vulnerable in future.  When we have it in defence we don't have the down the line get out if their ruckman can mark well, so we HAVE to find the spot up or the switch.  When they have it they always have the down the line get out if their ruckman is competitive in the air.  In future we really need to get TMac up to those contests to at least nullify their ruckman.

 

This is also where Hogan is valuable. He often gets the ball on half-back or on the wing. In fact, without looking at any stats to back up my argument, I suspect he takes more marks between half-back and half-forward than he does in the forward 50.

[poita 3,573]

I didn't see the game, but it seems pretty clear to me from reading the reviews that the following statements can be made:

• We are a better side with Pedersen in. It is not just his possessions or his willingness to make a contest, it is his ability to put himself in the right positions, including creating space for teammates.
• We are a better side with Oscar McDonald in. He frees up his brother and Frost to be more adventurous. He is doing enough things right to be persisted with, even if he makes a few errors.
• We are a better side with Vince in the middle. He is not, and never has been, a defender. Give him a job in the middle, he thrives and those around him look better too.
• Hibberd is a class act, a pity Melksham can't step up to the plate as well.
• Getting the right team balance is more important than the names on the team sheet. You can replace a ruckman with another ruckman, but you can't replace him with a small forward. Hawthorn at their peak would replace like for like, regardless of the player, and trust them to fill a role. We need to do the same.
• Our effort and workrate are far more important than our skills. It is why guys like Kent are not in the side. Of course, it causes problems when we lose players early in games, but hopefully we will avoid games like the Geelong debacle last year where we just don't turn up at all.
• Etihad is still a giant hole.

[Jaded No More 57,785]

54 minutes ago, Fifty-5 said:

Gratuitous sledge.

Watts fumbled a couple of times but was generally excellent and led an undersized forward line.  He kicked 4.1.  He rucked without relief for 3 quarters in the wet just 5.5 days ago.  It's some sort of miracle he got up for the game at all.

Agreed.

Some people are never satisfied. Yes he made a few blunders, but gees he's had a big month rucking so much more than he ever should have, and backed it up by kicking 4 goals yesterday.

His kicking is superb, him and Salem are pretty much the only players I want kicking around the ground or delivering the ball inside 50. 

He's having a great season! 

[old55 21,271]

4 minutes ago, Jaded said:

Agreed.

Some people are never satisfied. Yes he made a few blunders, but gees he's had a big month rucking so much more than he ever should have, and backed it up by kicking 4 goals yesterday.

His kicking is superb, him and Salem are pretty much the only players I want kicking around the ground or delivering the ball inside 50. 

He's having a great season! 

Agree. Don't mind Hibberd's kicking and Lewis is handy too.

[Jaded No More 57,785]

Just now, Fifty-5 said:

Agree. Don't mind Hibberd's kicking and Lewis is handy too.

Apologies to these two, as yes, they are very good users. Lewis has been a bit hit and miss this season, but Hibberd, unlike his other Essendon mate, is superb. A brilliant pick up! 

[beelzebub 22,225]

3 minutes ago, Jaded said:

Apologies to these two, as yes, they are very good users. Lewis has been a bit hit and miss this season, but Hibberd, unlike his other Essendon mate, is superb. A brilliant pick up! 

Two goals i loved... Both effectively wrong footed for where kicking from.

Lewis's from the boundary. Had no right to kick that...lucky he's left

And Truck's. Bang ..slotted.never looked like missing. ( Got a gem here )

[Nasher 33,047]

13 minutes ago, Jaded said:

Agreed.

Some people are never satisfied. Yes he made a few blunders, but gees he's had a big month rucking so much more than he ever should have, and backed it up by kicking 4 goals yesterday.

His kicking is superb, him and Salem are pretty much the only players I want kicking around the ground or delivering the ball inside 50. 

He's having a great season! 

On that note, Salem has been excellent this year. "Get more of the ball please" was my request last year, so far he's only had one sub-20 possession game. He's very trustworthy with ball in hand. Coming along very nicely now.

[Dr. Gonzo 22,412]

1 hour ago, leave it to deever said:

Yea but I still think O mac will be very good in 2 years and Howe was tad  lazy.

Just a tad?

[jnrmac 18,948]

13 hours ago, Dante said:

We will beat Hawthorn next week whether we get Hogan back or not, our forward line with Hannan in it is mobile and unpredictable, we have several avenues to goal at last.

Our backline is starting to gel and our midfield is better than theirs, but best of all, they are completely lacking in confidence and Alistair is now facing the reality of coaching a side without superstars. 

Today was a poor game but we won and that's all I care about, 4 points is the same for a good win or a bad win. I don't care if Daniher kicked poorly today because he usually does, we played them with a few of our better players out and on their dung heap. 

Goodwin has got the players believing that they can win any game with the team that gets picked and having missing players is irrelevant, there are no excuses and that can only be good long term for the MFC. 

He did kick 6.0 against us last year I think, so it has kind of evened out....

[Bobby McKenzie 2,169]

10 hours ago, A F said:

Well, a terrific weekend. Got a bit loosy goosy on Saturday night and got married to the Hawthorn missus (still haven't converted her). And then enjoyed the all important four points against those floggy Bombers. They looked tired and slow, whereas we were energetic, switched on and fierce. The kicking for two quarters was terrible, but our effort closed that gap.

A great game from Viney, Oliver, Petracca, Lewis, Pedersen, Hibberd and Frost. Hunt had his moments (but kicked poorly), Dom (also kicked poorly again - WTF is going on? I can't recall him hitting a target by foot) and Bernie looks better in the midfield - get him out of defence, he's hopeless there. Thought Hannan played a nice game too.

If Viney's game is a sign of things to come in the next few weeks, our midfield will start to look scary.

Oliver keeps going about his business. We say that every week. But 18 possies going into the last. Was glad to see him get above 30 again. What a star.

Frost's kicking has really improved, while Hibberd and Lewis make our backline look very, very good.

Handy game from Pedo. Let's see what his consistency is like.

From an intensity perspective, Jack Watts was very, very ordinary. He played from behind, failed to tackle stronger and probably went at about 10% all day. But he's a clever, skilful player and things went his way today.

Happy wedding present and a bit unexpected, as was the St Kilda win. Unlike my confidence going in to the Freo and Richmond games. Maybe I should keep expecting to lose?

Finally, a little thing I noticed was Petracca slapping Hurley on the arse and vice versa. Does anyone know if they're mates?

 

Gee, we still have Watts bashers in our midst. Have a look at the voting in our player of the year comp. I think you are out of line with your comments. But you are entitled to your opinion. Or are you just baiting me mate?

[Glenn Molloy 494]

4 hours ago, Webber said:

Jon Ralph in the little right wing rag gave Tom MacDonald the 3 votes, Dom Tyson had 29 possessions as you state, but also had a booming 637 metres gained (the most for either team, and yes, not all of them hit their target; 69% disposal efficiency). Jayden Hunt was next for us with 465, nobody else even in the 400's. Yeah yeah yeah, neither are perfect players, their foibles are frustrating, but that's football. Neither are anywhere near being de-selected, because as Simon Goodwin, the rest of the coaching staff and the players keep telling us, whether we understand it or not (many on here don't), they play their roles to a high team standard. Congrats on the life commitment AF, for better or worse, and all that good stuff. 

Jon Ralph is in the top 5 of dud footy media (and there's plenty to choose from) and confirmed it by giving 3 votes to TMac.  Overall he was definitely in our better players but the brain fades and turnovers mean that there is no way he was BOG.  I'd have Lewis, Hibberd, Pedersen and even Garlett, who continues to chip in with a few goals a week and great defensive pressure, ahead of him in the best this week.  

[beelzebub 22,225]

2 minutes ago, Glenn Molloy said:

Jon Ralph is in the top 5 of dud footy media (and there's plenty to choose from) and confirmed it by giving 3 votes to TMac.  Overall he was definitely in our better players but the brain fades and turnovers mean that there is no way he was BOG.  I'd have Lewis, Hibberd, Pedersen and even Garlett, who continues to chip in with a few goals a week and great defensive pressure, ahead of him in the best this week.  

Some measured clarity.

 

[old dee 22,848]

2 minutes ago, Glenn Molloy said:

Jon Ralph is in the top 5 of dud footy media (and there's plenty to choose from) and confirmed it by giving 3 votes to TMac.  Overall he was definitely in our better players but the brain fades and turnovers mean that there is no way he was BOG.  I'd have Lewis, Hibberd, Pedersen and even Garlett, who continues to chip in with a few goals a week and great defensive pressure, ahead of him in the best this week.  

I have been a critic of Garlett because of his consistancy  but this year he has had 5 out of six good games.

That is close to good as can be expected IMO.

[pineapple dee 2,892]

What was perhaps the most impressive aspect of the game was the smoothers, the two of which Frost pulled off were superb. That shows intent like nothing else.